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Old 10-14-2003, 10:22 AM   #1
SP33Demon
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Default Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

I've been taking Xenadrine EFX (ephedra free) for the past 2 weeks, and I barely feel it at all... It got great reviews from alot of studies, but I don't see what all the hype is about... It gives me a slight energy boost, but nothing like the old Xenadrine with the E/C/A stack... To make things worse, all companies that made pills with Ephedra are now making ephedra free pills from now on so they're not liable, wtf? Ephedra was the only known beta 3 blocker and now it's been taken off the market b/c of idiotic users who OD'd on it...

Back to the subject, if you use/d a fat burner, which ones have you used and what were your results?
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Old 10-14-2003, 11:35 AM   #2
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Default RE: Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

Head out to your local truck stop/Gas station along the highway. Grab yourself a couple of $7 bottle/60 tabs of ephedrine (usually at the counter in a cabinet). Then head to Walgreens and grab some generic caffeine pills at $10 for 100 tabs; and $5 for 500 tabs of aspirin. Take one of each. Voila.

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Old 10-14-2003, 11:48 AM   #3
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Default RE:Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

the aspirin is a waste really unless you get headaches from it.

I used ripped fuel and then metabolift by twin labs.

That and a diet/training schedule had me down about 40lbs in a month and almost 90lbs total in 3 months. (250ish to 150ish).

Too much dieting in my case (lost about 20-25lbs of muscle)...

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Old 10-14-2003, 11:56 AM   #4
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Default RE:Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

heheeh, yah make your own, much cheaper....

i know Kickers Extreme were taken off the shelves but we got them again somehow.

I also carry Stacker 2, Stacker 3, and Yellow Swarm. looking at the ingredients, they all have the same amount of ephedrine group alkaloids which is 25mg.

my customers swear by the ones that contain epedra in one way or another. other stuff just doesn't give u the special jitters
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Old 10-14-2003, 12:25 PM   #5
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Default RE:Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

Quote:
Originally posted by: alkemyst
the aspirin is a waste really unless you get headaches from it.

I used ripped fuel and then metabolift by twin labs.

That and a diet/training schedule had me down about 40lbs in a month and almost 90lbs total in 3 months. (250ish to 150ish).

Too much dieting in my case (lost about 20-25lbs of muscle)...

Pricewatch for Supplements
Twinlabs have discontinued Ripped Fuel with Ephedra, unfortunately...

I think the best thing to do is probably just buy ephedra on its own, until it's completely banned in the country (if that ever happens). Combine it with one of the non ephedra pills and it should give me the lift that I need...

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Old 10-14-2003, 02:50 PM   #6
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Default RE:Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

I have two unopened bottles left of metabolift maybe ebay ...

I need to get my rear back in shape....during my moving and looking for a place + my wife's INS junk I started having beer at home during the day....go up to 50-60 beers in a week and 20lbs

My problem is discipline...I always know going from flab to in shape is a 3 month deal for me....
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Old 10-14-2003, 03:08 PM   #7
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Default RE:Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

Quote:
Originally posted by: alkemyst
I have two unopened bottles left of metabolift maybe ebay ...

I need to get my rear back in shape....during my moving and looking for a place + my wife's INS junk I started having beer at home during the day....go up to 50-60 beers in a week and 20lbs

My problem is discipline...I always know going from flab to in shape is a 3 month deal for me....
Yeah beer is a no no during the week... try to keep it to weekends if u can.

I heard Stacker 2 and 3 are the ways to go, but how long until they cave in and discontinue these products and make "ephedra free" pills? This whole war on ephedra is just ridiculous.
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Old 10-14-2003, 03:12 PM   #8
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Default RE: Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

where can you pick up just ephedra on its own?
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Old 10-14-2003, 03:17 PM   #9
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Default RE: Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

I believe that the aspirin is not to counter headaches but rather it has a synergetic (if that's the dumb word to use) effect when combined with the other two substances. Thins your blood or something (?).

Anyway you could at least in the past buy pure ephedrine tablets from various supplement companies. I know I did in canada some years back.

As with all such threads I have to say now that if you're relying on this as your primary weight-loss method just stop taking them now; they are meant to supplement weight loss - not be the prime force behind it.
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Old 10-14-2003, 03:23 PM   #10
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Default RE:Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

Quote:
Originally posted by: Skoorb
I believe that the aspirin is not to counter headaches but rather it has a synergetic (if that's the dumb word to use) effect when combined with the other two substances. Thins your blood or something (?).

Anyway you could at least in the past buy pure ephedrine tablets from various supplement companies. I know I did in canada some years back.

As with all such threads I have to say now that if you're relying on this as your primary weight-loss method just stop taking them now; they are meant to supplement weight loss - not be the prime force behind it.

Amen brotha!
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Old 10-14-2003, 03:32 PM   #11
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Default RE:Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

Quote:
Originally posted by: Nutdotnet
Quote:
Originally posted by: Skoorb
I believe that the aspirin is not to counter headaches but rather it has a synergetic (if that's the dumb word to use) effect when combined with the other two substances. Thins your blood or something (?).

Anyway you could at least in the past buy pure ephedrine tablets from various supplement companies. I know I did in canada some years back.

As with all such threads I have to say now that if you're relying on this as your primary weight-loss method just stop taking them now; they are meant to supplement weight loss - not be the prime force behind it.

Amen brotha!
But it is so much easier to pop some pills and get your heart rate racing rather than to actually put forth physical effort and do some....dare I say it....exercise *gasp*. People are just getting so lazy. Sensible diet + exercise = weight loss.
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Old 10-14-2003, 04:31 PM   #12
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Default RE:Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

Aspirin is not part of the synergistic effect

Here is my workout although this was not during the diet phase, I was eating about every 3-4 hours a meal like my diet meals however those I only did for lunch and dinner while losing weight and did not add extra protein. (I alway had at least 30-40g of Protein each meal in my bulking stage)....

DIETING PHASE:

My day started at the gym around 4am and I did weights for about 2 hours then ran 30-45mins. I took my 2 capsules of ECA at wake

no food until lunch, sometimes a granola bar or the like if I was dying.

Lunch was a can of tuna or 4-6oz of turkey on pita with miracle whip lite and just enough so I could swallow it ....lettuce and tomato, pickles and pepper....sometimes celery and other veggies on the sandwich....whatever fit into the pita. 2 more ECA about this time (usually bet 10-11am)

I ate Snackwell gramham crackers (about an oz maybe just a couple)

upon leaving work or around 4-5ish, 2 more ECA

then ran when I got home about 30 mins

dinner was the same as lunch, sometimes having chicken.

I also sometimes ate black beans and white rice with salsa.

Sometimes lite tortilla chips and salsa was a snack.

No soda and nothing but water or tea.

My first month I was losing 2-3lbs a day.

BULKING PHASE
I was eating during this stage every 3-4 hours about the same as my dieting meals above, just more frequently (5-8 meals a day)
and about 30-40grams of protein per meal roughly....sometimes adding in shakes.

The workout below was the same workout I did while dieting except I did it in the morning and ran 1 more time at night. Of course while dieting I did no where near the weight below and at possibly at LEAST 4-5 sets of each exercise possibly 6-8 sets of much lighter weight.

Start 7:15pm End 10:30 pm (30 min run included I think...if not End time was 11pm)

all exercises are reps/lbs.....if marked with a + and a number those were reps I was helped or cheated on. If using DB (dumbbells) weight shown is for each dumbbell and not a total.

Pullovers 10/170, 7/170, 4/170 (machine)
Dumbell Inc Press 13/70, 8/85, 6/75+2 assisted, 5/75+3assisted, 4/80+2assisted
Pec Deck 12/110, 9/120, 7/120 (machine)
DB Bench Press 9/75, 6/75, 7/75, 4/80, 5/75
Pullups 11, 8, 6, 4+3 with assist, 3+4 with assist, 10 with assist
Bent rows 8/135, 7/135, 7/135, 7/135, 6/135 (later on in my training I switch to dumbbells)
Dips with wieght from waist: 12/50, 8/50, 8/50, 13/0, 9/0
Preacher Curls 7/110, 5/110, 5/100, 4/100
Hammer Curls 14/35, 12/35, 12/35
DB military press 7/50, 5/50, 4/50, 3/50
Lateral Raises/bent lateral raises (superset) 8/7 20lbs, 6/4 20lbs,
Squats 17/180, 16/180, 6/220, 4/240, 3/240
Leg Press 15/360, 12/410, 7/450, 5/500, 4/500, 8/450 (free weight sled)
Leg Curl 15/90, 6/100+3assist, 9/90, 6/90+2, 7/90+2, 6/90+2 (machine with free weights)
calf raises 15/135, 7/135, 9/135, 9/135, 9/135, 8/135 (machine with free weights)
supersetted with
donkey calf raises 14/450, 12/475, 7/500, 9/500, 9/500, 7/500 (machine with plates)

rest a bit and then ran 30mins at about 6.1-6.5MPH

At beginning of workout/warmup
Crunches 70/0, 27/0, 43/0, 20/0
Leg Raises 35/0, 32/0, 26/0, 21/0
Side Bends 3 sets of 20 ...weight I used wasn't recorded (large cage with low pulley and plates)
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Old 10-14-2003, 06:00 PM   #13
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Default RE:Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

Quote:
Originally posted by: alkemyst
Aspirin is not part of the synergistic effect Here is my workout although this was not during the diet phase, I was eating about every 3-4 hours a meal like my diet meals however those I only did for lunch and dinner while losing weight and did not add extra protein. (I alway had at least 30-40g of Protein each meal in my bulking stage).... DIETING PHASE: My day started at the gym around 4am and I did weights for about 2 hours then ran 30-45mins. I took my 2 capsules of ECA at wake no food until lunch, sometimes a granola bar or the like if I was dying. Lunch was a can of tuna or 4-6oz of turkey on pita with miracle whip lite and just enough so I could swallow it ....lettuce and tomato, pickles and pepper....sometimes celery and other veggies on the sandwich....whatever fit into the pita. 2 more ECA about this time (usually bet 10-11am) I ate Snackwell gramham crackers (about an oz maybe just a couple) upon leaving work or around 4-5ish, 2 more ECA then ran when I got home about 30 mins dinner was the same as lunch, sometimes having chicken. I also sometimes ate black beans and white rice with salsa. Sometimes lite tortilla chips and salsa was a snack. No soda and nothing but water or tea. My first month I was losing 2-3lbs a day. BULKING PHASE I was eating during this stage every 3-4 hours about the same as my dieting meals above, just more frequently (5-8 meals a day) and about 30-40grams of protein per meal roughly....sometimes adding in shakes. The workout below was the same workout I did while dieting except I did it in the morning and ran 1 more time at night. Of course while dieting I did no where near the weight below and at possibly at LEAST 4-5 sets of each exercise possibly 6-8 sets of much lighter weight. Start 7:15pm End 10:30 pm (30 min run included I think...if not End time was 11pm) all exercises are reps/lbs.....if marked with a + and a number those were reps I was helped or cheated on. If using DB (dumbbells) weight shown is for each dumbbell and not a total. Pullovers 10/170, 7/170, 4/170 (machine) Dumbell Inc Press 13/70, 8/85, 6/75+2 assisted, 5/75+3assisted, 4/80+2assisted Pec Deck 12/110, 9/120, 7/120 (machine) DB Bench Press 9/75, 6/75, 7/75, 4/80, 5/75 Pullups 11, 8, 6, 4+3 with assist, 3+4 with assist, 10 with assist Bent rows 8/135, 7/135, 7/135, 7/135, 6/135 (later on in my training I switch to dumbbells) Dips with wieght from waist: 12/50, 8/50, 8/50, 13/0, 9/0 Preacher Curls 7/110, 5/110, 5/100, 4/100 Hammer Curls 14/35, 12/35, 12/35 DB military press 7/50, 5/50, 4/50, 3/50 Lateral Raises/bent lateral raises (superset) 8/7 20lbs, 6/4 20lbs, Squats 17/180, 16/180, 6/220, 4/240, 3/240 Leg Press 15/360, 12/410, 7/450, 5/500, 4/500, 8/450 (free weight sled) Leg Curl 15/90, 6/100+3assist, 9/90, 6/90+2, 7/90+2, 6/90+2 (machine with free weights) calf raises 15/135, 7/135, 9/135, 9/135, 9/135, 8/135 (machine with free weights) supersetted with donkey calf raises 14/450, 12/475, 7/500, 9/500, 9/500, 7/500 (machine with plates) rest a bit and then ran 30mins at about 6.1-6.5MPH At beginning of workout/warmup Crunches 70/0, 27/0, 43/0, 20/0 Leg Raises 35/0, 32/0, 26/0, 21/0 Side Bends 3 sets of 20 ...weight I used wasn't recorded (large cage with low pulley and plates)
Um...no wonder you lost 90 pounds in 3 months.

Did you know that if you eat less (or starve yourself) and workout for 2 hours a day, you'll lose weight?
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Old 10-14-2003, 06:08 PM   #14
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Default RE:Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

Quote:
Originally posted by: GermyBoy

Um...no wonder you lost 90 pounds in 3 months.

Did you know that if you eat less (or starve yourself) and workout for 2 hours a day, you'll lose weight?
Not as fast as I did....and again I was over-training and under-eating....I lost alot of muscle....however it was more important to me that being fat for 6 months.

Now for the record I have been training since I was about 13 (I am 32 now) plus I have 7 years of Biology and Chemistry on a high college level (mostly 3000 and above, a few 5000 level courses) so I know what works and what's just the 'flavor of the month' at the gym

I can take off about 20lbs in 3 months easily with a good eating plan, beer on the weekend, and a work out 3x45mins a week....without cardio.

As a matter of fact I am finding that I lose weight faster focusing on heavy weights than cardio type exercises and running.

However, cardio is important, no sense in bulking up if you get winded climbing few flights of stairs or playing beach football.
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Old 10-14-2003, 06:10 PM   #15
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Default RE: Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

Best Fat burner = Excercise.
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Old 10-14-2003, 06:20 PM   #16
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Default RE:Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

Quote:
Originally posted by: Lyfer
Best Fat burner = Excercise.
agreed

Also for the ECA stack there were studies that showed that A was helpful in the process because of blood thinning effect, but that evidence supported its use in obese women (I don't know how they quantified obese here). You see white willow bark in some mixes to replace it.
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Old 10-14-2003, 06:25 PM   #17
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Default RE:Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

I tend to disagree about asprin not being useful in an ephedrine stack - most sympathomimetics (ephedrine in particular) raise blood pressure quite a bit - by adding asprin to the stack you can "thin out" the blood and prevent this somewhat. That being said, nobody should rely on fatburners because they can cause insulin resistance (which causes visceral fat after cessation) and heart damage if abused heavily. I know of one person in particular who used clenbuterol, a sympathomimetic which is rougly 2-3 times as powerful as ephedrine in addition to Thyroid hormone (cytomel) - he now has an enlarged heart, hypothyroidism (underfunctioning thyroid) Yes, he lost weight (a LOT) but the side effects were not worth it.
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Old 10-14-2003, 06:30 PM   #18
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Default RE:Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

best one is san tight
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Old 10-14-2003, 07:01 PM   #19
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Default RE:Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

The aspirin effect is overrated and any effects have been equal in research with or without it despite what possible effects may be shown. Those that are extremely obese may show a slight advantage.

White Willow is also not equal to aspirin despite it being an origin of it.

Now the reasons of the caffeine and aspirin are to extend the duration of the ephedrine effects....the caffeine is the main synergistic compound.

I have taken E+C and ECA quite alot over a decade.

Your best bet is to check out DrumLib he has alot of research with footnotes and sources to read.

Also to those saying 'if you abuse it'....if you abuse any compound even water it's bad. Taking 20/200 mg of EC 3x a day is easily tolerated in almost everyone. Those that have had problems have either had problems to begin with or were taking greater dosages and/or combining it with other drugs/dieuritics.

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Old 10-14-2003, 07:07 PM   #20
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Default RE: Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

You go from undereating and popping ECA's to "50-60 beers a week", and you criticize people on the Atkins plan??? [img]i/expressions/rolleye.gif[/img]
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Old 10-14-2003, 07:19 PM   #21
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Default RE:Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

My normal blood pressure is 120/70. After taking an ephedra stack which doesn't include asprin (standardized for 25 mg of ephedrine) it jumps up to 140/90 - if you're saying asprin can't possibly be helpful in this, I can't agree with you. The effects of asprin on blood thinning are well documented on pubmed.com - there are quite a few studies if you'd bother to look.
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Old 10-14-2003, 07:57 PM   #22
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Default RE: Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

Do any of you ever do cardio after taking ephedrine? I always avoid it because cardio for me isn't a light jog. Cardio is something on the order of 6-8 miles at around 80% of sprinting speed. That raises your heart rate so much, several Marines have died from heart attacks while doing cardio + ephedrine. Most supplement companies don't warn against this, but i suspect they don't expect people to be pushing their heart rates that high, either.
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Old 10-14-2003, 08:02 PM   #23
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Default RE: Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

best energy booster: sleep
best fat burner: excercise
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Old 10-14-2003, 08:06 PM   #24
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Default RE:Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

to get your max heart rate:

220-age = max heart rate

you want 70% of this for beginners and best is around 80-85% for fat loss



SAN tight isone of the better fat lose supplements
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Old 10-14-2003, 08:21 PM   #25
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Default RE:Best fat burner/energy booster? i.e.Stacker, Xenadrine...

DNP
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