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Old 08-06-2007, 03:17 PM   #1
nick1985
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In P&N lately I have noticed a lot of people quoting somebody, and then rearranging their words or just adding in new ones to the OP's statement in an attempt to make them look bad.


Text

Post 35, Jpeyton quotes me and then rearranges my words. Regardless of whether it is a personal attack or not(also in the thread he bashes my choice to serve), I think doing this should be against the rules. There are many instances in P&N where this happens, I simply used mine as an example because it just happened and it is a good example of what I am talking about.

In OT, people do it all the time in a joking manner, which I think is perfectly fine (and funny at times ) However in P&N, there is no such thing as a joke, and people who mis-quote are futher adding to the flame-wars in there.

Yeah, I could just stay out of P&N, but that wont stop this from happening on a daily basis. Maybe a rule against this should be put into effect?

Thanks for the consideration

If and when it becomes against the rules we will deal with it. As Moderators we do not make up the rules, we just enforce them.

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Old 08-06-2007, 06:57 PM   #2
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Default Quoting

Quote:
Originally posted by: nick1985
In P&N lately I have noticed a lot of people quoting somebody, and then rearranging their words or just adding in new ones to the OP's statement in an attempt to make them look bad.


Text

Post 35, Jpeyton quotes me and then rearranges my words. Regardless of whether it is a personal attack or not(also in the thread he bashes my choice to serve), I think doing this should be against the rules. There are many instances in P&N where this happens, I simply used mine as an example because it just happened and it is a good example of what I am talking about.

In OT, people do it all the time in a joking manner, which I think is perfectly fine (and funny at times ) However in P&N, there is no such thing as a joke, and people who mis-quote are further adding to the flame-wars in there.

Yeah, I could just stay out of P&N, but that wont stop this from happening on a daily basis. Maybe a rule against this should be put into effect?

Thanks for the consideration
Quote snippets are OK in P&N as long as they do not cause something to be taken out of context.

Rearranging words/phrases to mean something entirely different is not acceptable.

At times, adding/changing a word or two with some indication (bolding) that something is different may be tolerated

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Old 08-06-2007, 07:54 PM   #3
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I agree with the OP 100%.
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Old 08-07-2007, 12:44 AM   #4
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The whole "fixed" thing needs to be stopped. It has gotten out of hand and it muddies the water so to speak.
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Old 08-07-2007, 06:18 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally posted by: ProfJohn
The whole "fixed" thing needs to be stopped. It has gotten out of hand and it muddies the water so to speak.
In OT, 99.9% people do the "fixed" thing as a joke, and usually it is very funny. But in P&N, "fixed" never leads to a smile or a joke it is meant to fan the flames on already heated flame wars.
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Old 08-07-2007, 06:51 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally posted by: nick1985
Quote:
Originally posted by: ProfJohn
The whole "fixed" thing needs to be stopped. It has gotten out of hand and it muddies the water so to speak.
In OT, 99.9% people do the "fixed" thing as a joke, and usually it is very funny. But in P&N, "fixed" never leads to a smile or a joke it is meant to fan the flames on already heated flame wars.
If you are going to participate in P&N you need to grow thicker skin. IMO most ot the thread titles, like many of those by ProJo, are a lot more inflamming than this "Fixed" thing you are complaining about. And just like ProJo's thread titles it's easy to ignore it when somebody does this "Fixed" thing if you are not looking to get into a heated verbal confrontation

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Old 08-07-2007, 07:24 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Quote:
Originally posted by: nick1985
Quote:
Originally posted by: ProfJohn
The whole "fixed" thing needs to be stopped. It has gotten out of hand and it muddies the water so to speak.
In OT, 99.9% people do the "fixed" thing as a joke, and usually it is very funny. But in P&N, "fixed" never leads to a smile or a joke it is meant to fan the flames on already heated flame wars.
If you are going to participate in P&N you need to grow thicker skin. IMO most ot the thread titles, like many of those by ProJo, are a lot more inflamming than this "Fixed" thing you are complaining about. And just like ProJo's thread titles it's easy to ignore it when somebody does this "Fixed" thing if you are not looking to get into a heated verbal confrontation
Yeah I knew this is coming. "Why dont you just stay out of P&N". You're right, I could do that, but that wont stop unecessary fanning of flames will it? I just think a simple rule of no mis-quoting someone at the top of P&N (along with adding input to links) would be a step forward in making P&N a LITTLE more civil.
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Old 08-07-2007, 09:33 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally posted by: nick1985
Quote:
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Quote:
Originally posted by: nick1985
Quote:
Originally posted by: ProfJohn
The whole "fixed" thing needs to be stopped. It has gotten out of hand and it muddies the water so to speak.
In OT, 99.9% people do the "fixed" thing as a joke, and usually it is very funny. But in P&N, "fixed" never leads to a smile or a joke it is meant to fan the flames on already heated flame wars.
If you are going to participate in P&N you need to grow thicker skin. IMO most ot the thread titles, like many of those by ProJo, are a lot more inflamming than this "Fixed" thing you are complaining about. And just like ProJo's thread titles it's easy to ignore it when somebody does this "Fixed" thing if you are not looking to get into a heated verbal confrontation
Yeah I knew this is coming. "Why dont you just stay out of P&N". You're right, I could do that, but that wont stop unecessary fanning of flames will it? I just think a simple rule of no mis-quoting someone at the top of P&N (along with adding input to links) would be a step forward in making P&N a LITTLE more civil.
I didn't say "why don't you stay out of P&N", I said grow thicker skin or just ignore it instead or whinning about every little slight you may perceive.

As for you talking about making P&N more civil, how about not fanning the flames yourself? How many times have you been warned or given a timeout for personal insults? How about ProJo's Thread titles that are meant to inflame those who are on the opposite political spectrum?

I find suggestions on how to make P&N more civil from a couple of guys that are a major part of the problem so disengenuous and hypocritical.
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Old 08-07-2007, 11:19 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Quote:
Originally posted by: nick1985
Quote:
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Quote:
Originally posted by: nick1985
Quote:
Originally posted by: ProfJohn
The whole "fixed" thing needs to be stopped. It has gotten out of hand and it muddies the water so to speak.
In OT, 99.9% people do the "fixed" thing as a joke, and usually it is very funny. But in P&N, "fixed" never leads to a smile or a joke it is meant to fan the flames on already heated flame wars.
If you are going to participate in P&N you need to grow thicker skin. IMO most ot the thread titles, like many of those by ProJo, are a lot more inflamming than this "Fixed" thing you are complaining about. And just like ProJo's thread titles it's easy to ignore it when somebody does this "Fixed" thing if you are not looking to get into a heated verbal confrontation
Yeah I knew this is coming. "Why dont you just stay out of P&N". You're right, I could do that, but that wont stop unecessary fanning of flames will it? I just think a simple rule of no mis-quoting someone at the top of P&N (along with adding input to links) would be a step forward in making P&N a LITTLE more civil.
I didn't say "why don't you stay out of P&N", I said grow thicker skin or just ignore it instead or whinning about every little slight you may perceive.

As for you talking about making P&N more civil, how about not fanning the flames yourself? How many times have you been warned or given a timeout for personal insults? How about ProJo's Thread titles that are meant to inflame those who are on the opposite political spectrum?

I find suggestions on how to make P&N more civil from a couple of guys that are a major part of the problem so disengenuous and hypocritical.
So you know the intent of my thread titles better than me?
Maybe you can post one of these thread titles so I can see what you are talking about.

However, 90% of my thread titles come from the source material I am posting.
Here are my most recent thread titles, which ones are meant to inflame?
"The New Republic?s ?Baghdad Diarist? admits to exaggerations and falsehoods
Does the left ever tell the truth about anything?"
"Mid-Year Budget Update!!! On track for a $205 billion deficit for FY 2007 "
"Republican debate on ABC
anyone watching?? "
"Gingrich Predicts Clinton-Obama Ticket
Makes a lot of sense "
"Chris Wallace spanks Rush Feingold over the US attorneys
Dems still have NO evidence at all of any illegality " (I believe the term "spanks" came from Drudge.)
"House Majority Whip: Positive Report by Petraeus Could Split House Democrats on War
Good news for the country is bad news for the Democrats "
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Old 08-07-2007, 11:23 AM   #10
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Default Quoting

Quote:
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Quote:
Originally posted by: nick1985
Quote:
Originally posted by: ProfJohn
The whole "fixed" thing needs to be stopped. It has gotten out of hand and it muddies the water so to speak.
In OT, 99.9% people do the "fixed" thing as a joke, and usually it is very funny. But in P&N, "fixed" never leads to a smile or a joke it is meant to fan the flames on already heated flame wars.
If you are going to participate in P&N you need to grow thicker skin. IMO most ot the thread titles, like many of those by ProJo, are a lot more inflamming than this "Fixed" thing you are complaining about. And just like ProJo's thread titles it's easy to ignore it when somebody does this "Fixed" thing if you are not looking to get into a heated verbal confrontation
Red I think you miss the point about the ?fixed? thing.
I know what I said and can ignore it when I see it ?fixed? but someone else might read the thread and miss the ?fixed? line and think I said something I did not.

Now I have to wonder about one thing?
If I go and ?fix? your MOD post on the OP I get a nice vacation.
So why is it ok to ?fix? one persons quotes, but not ?fix? the MODs quotes?

I have seen how pissed off the MODs get when someone edits what they say, don?t you think users like myself have a right to be pissed off when people change what we say and try to make it look like we said something totally different?
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Old 08-07-2007, 11:57 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by: ProfJohn
Quote:
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Quote:
Originally posted by: nick1985
Quote:
Originally posted by: ProfJohn
The whole "fixed" thing needs to be stopped. It has gotten out of hand and it muddies the water so to speak.
In OT, 99.9% people do the "fixed" thing as a joke, and usually it is very funny. But in P&N, "fixed" never leads to a smile or a joke it is meant to fan the flames on already heated flame wars.
If you are going to participate in P&N you need to grow thicker skin. IMO most ot the thread titles, like many of those by ProJo, are a lot more inflamming than this "Fixed" thing you are complaining about. And just like ProJo's thread titles it's easy to ignore it when somebody does this "Fixed" thing if you are not looking to get into a heated verbal confrontation
Red I think you miss the point about the ?fixed? thing.
I know what I said and can ignore it when I see it ?fixed? but someone else might read the thread and miss the ?fixed? line and think I said something I did not.

Now I have to wonder about one thing?
If I go and ?fix? your MOD post on the OP I get a nice vacation.
So why is it ok to ?fix? one persons quotes, but not ?fix? the MODs quotes?

I have seen how pissed off the MODs get when someone edits what they say, don?t you think users like myself have a right to be pissed off when people change what we say and try to make it look like we said something totally different?
"Fix" what I post as a user and you have nothing to fear (well I might piss in your ear), "Fix" any Mod edit and enjoy a couple of days off!!

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Old 08-07-2007, 04:11 PM   #12
nick1985
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If a suggestion to help out the forums gets turned around by the mod where he makes claims against another poster (claims that are unsubstantiated...his thread titles seem fair to me) then you guys can feel free to lock this and move on. Justifying bad behavior by pointing to "bad behavior" wont help the forum become more civil.

As far as your claims against me (again, which have nothing to do with the issue at hand), you are free to have whatever your opinion you may wish. The majority of my posts were from back when I was in high-school/early college years and a lot of them were probably immature. I took a year and a half break and after my college graduation, recently started posting again. I feel I have matured, but if you still hold a grudge against me (which is obvious by many of your posts that you do), then so be it.
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Old 08-07-2007, 08:32 PM   #13
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Default Quoting

Quote:
Originally posted by: ProfJohn
Quote:
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Quote:
Originally posted by: nick1985
Quote:
Originally posted by: ProfJohn
The whole "fixed" thing needs to be stopped. It has gotten out of hand and it muddies the water so to speak.
In OT, 99.9% people do the "fixed" thing as a joke, and usually it is very funny. But in P&N, "fixed" never leads to a smile or a joke it is meant to fan the flames on already heated flame wars.
If you are going to participate in P&N you need to grow thicker skin. IMO most ot the thread titles, like many of those by ProJo, are a lot more inflamming than this "Fixed" thing you are complaining about. And just like ProJo's thread titles it's easy to ignore it when somebody does this "Fixed" thing if you are not looking to get into a heated verbal confrontation
Red I think you miss the point about the ?fixed? thing.
I know what I said and can ignore it when I see it ?fixed? but someone else might read the thread and miss the ?fixed? line and think I said something I did not.

Now I have to wonder about one thing?
If I go and ?fix? your MOD post on the OP I get a nice vacation.
So why is it ok to ?fix? one persons quotes, but not ?fix? the MODs quotes?

I have seen how pissed off the MODs get when someone edits what they say, don?t you think users like myself have a right to be pissed off when people change what we say and try to make it look like we said something totally different?
If you honesty think that someone editing a members post and someone editing a Mods post are the same thing....
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Old 08-07-2007, 11:48 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
"Fix" any Mod edit and enjoy a couple of days off!!
Please tell this to the mod who gave me a vacation a few months ago for "editing" his quote which I didn't actually "edit". Can you tell me who it was, so I can hold him accountable?
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Old 08-08-2007, 06:14 AM   #15
Red Dawn
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Default Quoting

Quote:
Originally posted by: ProfJohn
Quote:
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Quote:
Originally posted by: nick1985
Quote:
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
Quote:
Originally posted by: nick1985
Quote:
Originally posted by: ProfJohn
The whole "fixed" thing needs to be stopped. It has gotten out of hand and it muddies the water so to speak.
In OT, 99.9% people do the "fixed" thing as a joke, and usually it is very funny. But in P&N, "fixed" never leads to a smile or a joke it is meant to fan the flames on already heated flame wars.
If you are going to participate in P&N you need to grow thicker skin. IMO most ot the thread titles, like many of those by ProJo, are a lot more inflamming than this "Fixed" thing you are complaining about. And just like ProJo's thread titles it's easy to ignore it when somebody does this "Fixed" thing if you are not looking to get into a heated verbal confrontation
Yeah I knew this is coming. "Why dont you just stay out of P&N". You're right, I could do that, but that wont stop unecessary fanning of flames will it? I just think a simple rule of no mis-quoting someone at the top of P&N (along with adding input to links) would be a step forward in making P&N a LITTLE more civil.
I didn't say "why don't you stay out of P&N", I said grow thicker skin or just ignore it instead or whinning about every little slight you may perceive.

As for you talking about making P&N more civil, how about not fanning the flames yourself? How many times have you been warned or given a timeout for personal insults? How about ProJo's Thread titles that are meant to inflame those who are on the opposite political spectrum?

I find suggestions on how to make P&N more civil from a couple of guys that are a major part of the problem so disengenuous and hypocritical.
So you know the intent of my thread titles better than me?
Maybe you can post one of these thread titles so I can see what you are talking about.

However, 90% of my thread titles come from the source material I am posting.
Here are my most recent thread titles, which ones are meant to inflame?
"The New Republic?s ?Baghdad Diarist? admits to exaggerations and falsehoods
Does the left ever tell the truth about anything?"
"Mid-Year Budget Update!!! On track for a $205 billion deficit for FY 2007 "
"Republican debate on ABC
anyone watching?? "
"Gingrich Predicts Clinton-Obama Ticket
Makes a lot of sense "
"Chris Wallace spanks Rush Feingold over the US attorneys
Dems still have NO evidence at all of any illegality " (I believe the term "spanks" came from Drudge.)
"House Majority Whip: Positive Report by Petraeus Could Split House Democrats on War
Good news for the country is bad news for the Democrats "
LOL, you edited the one you know I was talking about:shocked::roll:. That's cool, if you want to change the atmosphere there by reconsidering posting inflamatory titles that's a good start.
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Old 08-08-2007, 06:36 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by: nick1985
If a suggestion to help out the forums gets turned around by the mod where he makes claims against another poster (claims that are unsubstantiated...his thread titles seem fair to me) then you guys can feel free to lock this and move on. Justifying bad behavior by pointing to "bad behavior" wont help the forum become more civil.

As far as your claims against me (again, which have nothing to do with the issue at hand), you are free to have whatever your opinion you may wish. The majority of my posts were from back when I was in high-school/early college years and a lot of them were probably immature. I took a year and a half break and after my college graduation, recently started posting again. I feel I have matured, but if you still hold a grudge against me (which is obvious by many of your posts that you do), then so be it.
I don't hold a grudge, I just don't believe that a known past trouble maker there should be the one to make suggestions about rule changes. You say you matured, well if you have that's good news for those of us who have to moderate that forum. Hopefully after time the stigma of being a troublemaker will change to that of one who is a good example of what others should emulate. I've taken the time to read some of your recent posts and it seems that you are trying to be a good contributing member.

BTW I don't think making a rule that only applies to one forum with regards to posting is going to happen. According to AT HQ we aren't going to micromanage plus we are going to be a lot more lenient. The suggestion you are making doesn't seem to fit in with that vision.

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Old 08-08-2007, 11:19 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally posted by: joshsquall
Quote:
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
"Fix" any Mod edit and enjoy a couple of days off!!
Please tell this to the mod who gave me a vacation a few months ago for "editing" his quote which I didn't actually "edit". Can you tell me who it was, so I can hold him accountable?
As stated in previous threads, the past actions are a locked book.
Which Moderator did what to who is not going to be revealed. In the present, Moderator actions are being identified with the appropriate Moderator.

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Old 08-08-2007, 07:42 PM   #18
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Quote:
Now I have to wonder about one thing?
If I go and ?fix? your MOD post on the OP I get a nice vacation.
So why is it ok to ?fix? one persons quotes, but not ?fix? the MODs quotes?
If you don't see the difference between editing a moderator comment which is embedded in your own post vs someone quoting you and changing it in a different post... If users where editing your original post then your comparison (and concern) would be much more justified.

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