Xbox TV set top a 28nm 360 chip?

[psoomah]

That would be one low cost chipset with the ability to natively play the entire Xbox 360 catalog of games and stream all it's services. A chipset Microsoft owns.

Add in Kinect 2 capability with Kinect backward compatibility, an embedded 32gb or so ssd, 2 1/2" 320-500gb hdd, Tuner/DRV capability... still talking a box with minimal power and cooling requirements coming in under $200 to volume manufacture. Thinking this is the real reason Microsoft dropped Media Center from Windows 8.

Sell it for $99 with a two year Xbox Live subscription and next Christmas that would be one hot, Hot, HOT seller. Sell the 720 (which also has the 360 backward compatible chip) to the existing gamer centric base and ship jumping PS and Nintendo gamers ... and later on Xbox TV buyers looking to upgrade.

Sell a custom specced version of the box to Cable companies and let them dip their beaks into the Xbox generated revenue stream.

Formidable.

[Doppel]

I know you love that Kinect 2

I'm not sure there's a compelling business case for MS increasing 360 sales by integrating with other devices at the same time as releasing the 720; the former could hurt uptake of the latter.

[psoomah]

Originally Posted by Doppel

I know you love that Kinect 2

I'm not sure there's a compelling business case for MS increasing 360 sales by integrating with other devices at the same time as releasing the 720; the former could hurt uptake of the latter.

It's pretty solid Microsoft has a two tier strategy and will be releasing a low cost Xbox set top box long with the higher priced Xbox 720. The question is what processor goes in that box.

My reasoning is a 28nm Xbox 360 chip in that set top box makes the most financial and growth sense.

1. Microsoft already owns the architecture and at 28nm it would be very cheap to produce, use little power and need minimal cooling.
2. The existing 360 'hard core' gamer base would definitely buy the 720 at the higher price point, but would recommend the Xbox TV to family and friends.
3. The idea of a cheap set top box is to grow a new demographic and pull in casual and Nintendo gamers. current users of streaming boxes and the curious to substantially expand the Xbox Live base.
4. The idea of giving them the ability to play 360 games is to give them a taste of harder core gaming which would lead those that like it to upgrade to the 720.
5. It could easily be sold at $99 with a 2 year subscription. That would be an offer for an Xbox branded console tens of millions couldn't resist.

[psoomah]

Originally Posted by Doppel

I know you love that Kinect 2

I do love pondering the potential of it, turning it over in my mind, extrapolating significances into the future. I am a bit dismayed at the widespread inability of people to see past their present reality fixed ideas ... or have any interest in trying.

Otherwise I am purely a PC gamer and don't own a console, nor am I likely to.

[Doppel]

Originally Posted by psoomah

I do love pondering the potential of it, turning it over in my mind, extrapolating significances into the future. I am a bit dismayed at the widespread inability of people to see past their present reality fixed ideas ... or have any interest in trying.

Otherwise I am purely a PC gamer and don't own a console, nor am I likely to.

Remember i agreed with you on the potential of image recognition n the future.

I just really have to think that Microsoft will do away with the 360 across the board when 720 comes out. I know they may want two versions of the next gen but I suspect both will still be able to run all the games.

[psoomah]

Originally Posted by Doppel

Remember i agreed with you on the potential of image recognition n the future.

I just really have to think that Microsoft will do away with the 360 across the board when 720 comes out. I know they may want two versions of the next gen but I suspect both will still be able to run all the games.

How would they be able to run all the games without a 360 chip for backward compatibility? The whole idea of Microsoft buying the architecture IP for the Xbox 360 was to enable full hardware backward compatibility in future consoles.

In the leaked Microsoft 2010 Power Point presentation on the Xbox 720 (as the presentation referred to it), which was solidly verified as real, the use of a 3x PPC @3.2ghz chip (the Xbox 360 CPU) for backward compatibility was mentioned twice.

If both versions of the Xbox can run all the games, they would have to have the same processors ... same hardware, same cost ... wouldn't they be the same machine?

[BD2003]

Originally Posted by psoomah

How would they be able to run all the games without a 360 chip for backward compatibility? The whole idea of Microsoft buying the architecture IP for the Xbox 360 was to enable full hardware backward compatibility in future consoles.

In the leaked Microsoft 2010 Power Point presentation on the Xbox 720 (as the presentation referred to it), which was solidly verified as real, the use of a 3x PPC @3.2ghz chip (the Xbox 360 CPU) for backward compatibility was mentioned twice.

If both versions of the Xbox can run all the games, they would have to have the same processors ... same hardware, same cost ... wouldn't they be the same machine?

The leaked documents had a box with 3 APUs - the 360 SoC for BC, a smaller one for always on, media and apps, and a larger one for games.

The set top box is likely to just have the smaller SoC.

Either way, itll basically be an Apple TV competitor, so you can expect sales less than that dismal little box....so its not really that exciting. Itll be a microsoft version of what others have been doing for years, none of which require an XBL sub.

[dagnastyep]

I don't think there's anyway that the "xbox tv" or whatever they call it will use a 28nm version of the 360 SoC. Why? Power and heat. The 360s on the main menu currently uses 67watts, and jumps to ~77 during gameplay. If xbox is making something that is going to compete with Roku HD and Apple TV, both small and power efficient devices it will have to do the same. It will most likely use a low power moble SoC, either some ARM variant or possibly a few of AMDs upcoming jaguar cores, along with a fanless cooling system so it's quite.

[Doppel]

I can see the 720 having 360 BC, and maybe MS uses the 360 chip elsewhere for some apple tv knock off but in terms of gaming MS will certainly put the 360 to bed once the 720 is out. Otherwise 720 uptake is compromised.

[kommisar]

Originally Posted by psoomah

The whole idea of Microsoft buying the architecture IP for the Xbox 360 was to enable full hardware backward compatibility in future consoles.

The primary reason MS acquired the CPU and GPU IP was to allow them to refactor the chip set over the Xbox 2 console life cycle to new fab nodes for cost reduction reasons. This was the big lesson they learned from Xbox 1. Now that doesn't mean they won't do a BC chip in Xbox 3 its just you can't use the fact that they have chip IP as supporting evidence for its inclusion since the motivation for acquiring the IP had nothing to do with BC.