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Old 02-07-2013, 01:18 PM   #1
Chiefcrowe
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Default Libre Office 4.0 Released

http://blog.documentfoundation.org/2...ibreoffice-4-0
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Old 02-07-2013, 04:24 PM   #2
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So does it still suck versus MS Office?
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Old 02-07-2013, 05:20 PM   #3
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So does it still suck versus MS Office?
Why don't you try it and see? Or are you afraid it's going to cost you $149.99 just to find out?
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Old 02-07-2013, 05:33 PM   #4
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Thanks Chief
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Old 02-07-2013, 05:41 PM   #5
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I was reading about it earlier. Looks like a bunch of interesting changes. Can't wait til it hits the repos.
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Old 02-07-2013, 09:51 PM   #6
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This is getting interesting. No doubt if I was doing a small startup I would use this. Well, maybe. O365 is kind of cool
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Old 02-07-2013, 10:12 PM   #7
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This is getting interesting. No doubt if I was doing a small startup I would use this. Well, maybe. O365 is kind of cool
Can a small startup afford $6 a month per user? Yes. So I agree with your comment about Office 365. Shell out the bucks for the full desktop suite and it's unbeatable. The money you save in productivity makes up for the "free" LibreOffice. Just my $.02.
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Old 02-08-2013, 07:00 AM   #8
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slugg, have you actually spent time (like months) using Libre/Open Office? For many users, it has EVERYTHING that is needed. People need to learn the menu system because it is not a carbon copy of MS Office... but then, they've had to relearn some things moving to Windows 7 and also to Windows 8.

So why all the hate?
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Old 02-08-2013, 08:38 AM   #9
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Can a small startup afford $6 a month per user? Yes. So I agree with your comment about Office 365. Shell out the bucks for the full desktop suite and it's unbeatable. The money you save in productivity makes up for the "free" LibreOffice. Just my $.02.
That depends heavily on the users in that small business and the business itself.
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Old 02-08-2013, 12:47 PM   #10
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slugg, have you actually spent time (like months) using Libre/Open Office? For many users, it has EVERYTHING that is needed. People need to learn the menu system because it is not a carbon copy of MS Office... but then, they've had to relearn some things moving to Windows 7 and also to Windows 8.

So why all the hate?
I wouldn't say I hate LibreOffice. It's just the reality of the matter that MS Office really dominates the productivity suite market. It's due to the skills and experience involved, cost effectiveness, and target market.

Generally, a company is looking at a potential employee, experience in whatever tools that company already uses is by far more valuable than an alternative. And most likely, that company uses MS Office. Likewise, if you're trying to develop skills, you're better off learning what the industry uses: Microsoft Office.

In the case of small businesses and startups, I still think Microsoft's solution is better. If the startup is super small (two friends, for example), then chances are, they're using their personal computers. They would then be using their personally licensed software. A lot of people have some version of MS Office already. If they don't, then Office 365 starts at 4 bucks a month, but the $6 option is totally worth it if you ever plan on working real-time online with your partner(s). Cook at home one more time a month and you've already recovered your cost.

If the startup is a bit bigger (let's say 10 people), then you have a couple options. If you want to stay traditional, you could go for a volume licensing agreement for $64 per license, which is a one-time purchase. Or if the company would like a cloud-based, fully managed solution, $6/month is really nothing.

No matter what the company size, if it can't afford a $6/month overhead per employee, then that company has no business staying in business.

So where does that leave LibreOffice? Well one thing's certain; people who hate Microsoft definitely like LibreOffice. Or if you're stuck in a Linux environment and just need something for minor work, it's a no brainer. I wouldn't say it's appropriate for educational institutions since all of them get deals with Microsoft or other OEMs (example: Dell might absorb the licensing cost). Developers like LibreOffice; you can use its API and borrow some of its functionality into your own software, which is definitely nifty. That being said, you can do the same with MS Office, although you obviously can't distribute MS Office with your proprietary software.

So what about personal use? Eh, maybe. I'd believe that. But chances are, if you ever get a desk job, your employer will provide Microsoft Office. Why learn two tools when you can learn one? But I guess if you plan on never using a computer in any job you'll ever have, then LibreOffice makes perfect sense.

Now keep in mind that my reply is talking in the general case. I'm more than aware that a select few companies exclusively use free tools. Then again, most of those pay for support, so the point is moot.
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Old 02-09-2013, 11:53 AM   #11
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slug,

You make a number of very valid points. I'll give you one from my personal experience.

I'm in charge of the Data, Programming, & IT/IS departments for the corporation I work for. The other day, one of the Data people was working with an Excel project and needed to save a Tab delimited file without any text qualifiers (quotes) around any of the fields, just tabs as delimiters.

After searching a ton on the web, she couldn't figure out how to do it. So I looked, and couldn't come up with a Excel setting for this either.

I told her to fire up Libre Office (which I keep on all the Data machines, in addition to MS Office). In about a minute, we were able to save the tab delimited file, with out any quotes.

I know that's a pretty rare scenario for the average person. But, from my personal perspective, there are still things that I can do in Libre Office that I simply cannot do with MS Office... though they are admittedly pretty rare.
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Old 02-09-2013, 04:07 PM   #12
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slug,

You make a number of very valid points. I'll give you one from my personal experience.

I'm in charge of the Data, Programming, & IT/IS departments for the corporation I work for. The other day, one of the Data people was working with an Excel project and needed to save a Tab delimited file without any text qualifiers (quotes) around any of the fields, just tabs as delimiters.

After searching a ton on the web, she couldn't figure out how to do it. So I looked, and couldn't come up with a Excel setting for this either.

I told her to fire up Libre Office (which I keep on all the Data machines, in addition to MS Office). In about a minute, we were able to save the tab delimited file, with out any quotes.

I know that's a pretty rare scenario for the average person. But, from my personal perspective, there are still things that I can do in Libre Office that I simply cannot do with MS Office... though they are admittedly pretty rare.
Interesting. I've always believe that open source software is a good option for specialized tasks that may be one-offs, or similar. You've described one of those situations. Interestingly, though, the original project was done in Excel to begin with . Anyhow, for future reference, select all the cells, copy to clipboard, then paste into notepad. That'll give you all the cell data with tabs in between - without quotes.

Why wasn't it an obvious solution? Well, looks like Microsoft dropped the ball on that one. I, too, think it's stupid. Oh well.
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Old 02-09-2013, 07:13 PM   #13
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I wouldn't say I hate LibreOffice. It's just the reality of the matter that MS Office really dominates the productivity suite market. It's due to the skills and experience involved, cost effectiveness, and target market.

Generally, a company is looking at a potential employee, experience in whatever tools that company already uses is by far more valuable than an alternative. And most likely, that company uses MS Office. Likewise, if you're trying to develop skills, you're better off learning what the industry uses: Microsoft Office.

In the case of small businesses and startups, I still think Microsoft's solution is better. If the startup is super small (two friends, for example), then chances are, they're using their personal computers. They would then be using their personally licensed software. A lot of people have some version of MS Office already. If they don't, then Office 365 starts at 4 bucks a month, but the $6 option is totally worth it if you ever plan on working real-time online with your partner(s). Cook at home one more time a month and you've already recovered your cost.

If the startup is a bit bigger (let's say 10 people), then you have a couple options. If you want to stay traditional, you could go for a volume licensing agreement for $64 per license, which is a one-time purchase. Or if the company would like a cloud-based, fully managed solution, $6/month is really nothing.

No matter what the company size, if it can't afford a $6/month overhead per employee, then that company has no business staying in business.

So where does that leave LibreOffice? Well one thing's certain; people who hate Microsoft definitely like LibreOffice. Or if you're stuck in a Linux environment and just need something for minor work, it's a no brainer. I wouldn't say it's appropriate for educational institutions since all of them get deals with Microsoft or other OEMs (example: Dell might absorb the licensing cost). Developers like LibreOffice; you can use its API and borrow some of its functionality into your own software, which is definitely nifty. That being said, you can do the same with MS Office, although you obviously can't distribute MS Office with your proprietary software.

So what about personal use? Eh, maybe. I'd believe that. But chances are, if you ever get a desk job, your employer will provide Microsoft Office. Why learn two tools when you can learn one? But I guess if you plan on never using a computer in any job you'll ever have, then LibreOffice makes perfect sense.

Now keep in mind that my reply is talking in the general case. I'm more than aware that a select few companies exclusively use free tools. Then again, most of those pay for support, so the point is moot.
So in your mind MS has won and anyone else doing anything separate is wasting their time and should give up?
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Old 02-10-2013, 09:13 AM   #14
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I have happily used LibreOffice (and OpenOffice before it) for quite a few years. For the most part it deals with my light needs more than adequately. I use Office in businesses all the time and the basic documents and sheets and presentations I create there isn't really much difference between them, I can always get done what I need in both.

I do prefer the way Open Office does text styles as it makes it easier to organise than with Office but I can coax Office to do custom styles just with a bit more noise and a little bit more error prone. Excel has more functions that are useful for doing more advance maths, it also draws frame time graphs much faster than Calc. But I rarely run into things I can't do in one or the other.
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Old 02-11-2013, 04:26 AM   #15
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i rather my employees learn to use libre office just because if they couldn't learn to use it then they're no good to me as employees
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Old 02-11-2013, 01:40 PM   #16
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thanks for the info about Libre Office 4.0 which i have downloaded already
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Old 02-11-2013, 01:49 PM   #17
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i rather my employees learn to use libre office just because if they couldn't learn to use it then they're no good to me as employees
That would be a good interview test. Hiring a Photoshop guy? Give him a task, a time limit, and Gimp to complete it. That would help separate the thinkers from the button pushers.
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Old 02-11-2013, 02:02 PM   #18
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That would be a good interview test. Hiring a Photoshop guy? Give him a task, a time limit, and Gimp to complete it. That would help separate the thinkers from the button pushers.
Depends on the job, sometimes all you want is a button pusher that can follow directions well. =)
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Old 02-11-2013, 06:58 PM   #19
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So in your mind MS has won and anyone else doing anything separate is wasting their time and should give up?
LibreOffice should stop wasting its time and give up trying to be an alternative to Microsoft Office. Until they have something awesome and new and compelling, it's still just second best.

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That would be a good interview test. Hiring a Photoshop guy? Give him a task, a time limit, and Gimp to complete it. That would help separate the thinkers from the button pushers.
Funny. Yet, very true. That would be a very good job interview task for "Office" experts!
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Old 02-11-2013, 07:07 PM   #20
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LibreOffice should stop wasting its time and give up trying to be an alternative to Microsoft Office. Until they have something awesome and new and compelling, it's still just second best.

But why? Are you opposed to all free alternatives to closed software or just a few special cases? Does that apply to non-free alternatives too? Should MS kill off Hyper-V because VMware was there first and still has a much better product? Should Apple kill off OS X and iOS because Windows and Android kill them in marketshare?
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Old 02-12-2013, 07:08 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by Nothinman View Post
But why? Are you opposed to all free alternatives to closed software or just a few special cases? Does that apply to non-free alternatives too? Should MS kill off Hyper-V because VMware was there first and still has a much better product? Should Apple kill off OS X and iOS because Windows and Android kill them in marketshare?
Winner!
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Old 02-12-2013, 08:53 AM   #22
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I'm in charge of the Data, Programming, & IT/IS departments for the corporation I work for. The other day, one of the Data people was working with an Excel project and needed to save a Tab delimited file without any text qualifiers (quotes) around any of the fields, just tabs as delimiters.

After searching a ton on the web, she couldn't figure out how to do it. So I looked, and couldn't come up with a Excel setting for this either.

I told her to fire up Libre Office (which I keep on all the Data machines, in addition to MS Office). In about a minute, we were able to save the tab delimited file, with out any quotes.
Why not just "save as" tab delimited file (from excel) and then just strip out (find replace) all undesired characters\formatting using text editor of choice?
Takes 10 Seconds

(Not commenting on productivity suite debate, just wondering why file creation turned into debacle)
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Old 02-13-2013, 06:35 AM   #23
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Reasonable question. And reasonable suggestion. Just trying to point out that there are some things that Libre does that MS does not.

I was thinking about this open source vs MS debate last night. Imagine if this extended to web servers? Apache is by far the most used out there, not IIS.
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Old 02-13-2013, 01:02 PM   #24
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But why? Are you opposed to all free alternatives to closed software or just a few special cases? Does that apply to non-free alternatives too? Should MS kill off Hyper-V because VMware was there first and still has a much better product? Should Apple kill off OS X and iOS because Windows and Android kill them in marketshare?
I must admit, your argument is a good one and I don't have much to say against it. Heck, I'll even agree with your point.

But specifically with a productivity suit in mind, I still stand by my opinion that MS Office is the way to go. It's just a lot more practical. I may be wrong, but that's just my opinion.
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Old 02-13-2013, 01:46 PM   #25
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Compatibility. Regardless of what you use, the world uses MS Office. I've heard that file compatibility is improved in Libre4 but until it's bulletproof the productivity gamble isn't worth it for anyone who ever has to deal with external files.
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