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Old 02-05-2013, 10:05 PM   #276
sandorski
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Quote:
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If no one has a God detector, how you know that a "God" doesn't exist?
Burden of Proof.

Can you answer my question?
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Old 02-05-2013, 10:06 PM   #277
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That circle you're running in is getting smaller and smaller.
Eh, the walls are closing in, aren't they?
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Old 02-05-2013, 10:09 PM   #278
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Burden of Proof.

Can you answer my question?
I will if you let me know what kind/type of proof would be sufficent enough for you so that I could know where to start.
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Old 02-05-2013, 10:11 PM   #279
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Here's a dilemma I have with the creation idea: Where did logic come from? Was it given to us by God? If so, why would God give us this ability/trait (whatever you wanna call it), and give it in especially high amounts to those that are generally of greater intelligence than average, and then require us to greatly dispense with this gift (requiring faith in an incredibly illogical book), or condemn us to an eternal agony in Hell?

Perhaps that is the challenge God has put before us: Logic was given to us by the devil, and we must resist this power it/he has bestowed upon us, and only through this resistance will we be able to truly seal tight our minds from the devil's contamination. It's such a struggle, but I have made sense of it, so it must be true.
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Old 02-05-2013, 10:13 PM   #280
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Why don't you go find out if their interpretation is correct, and come tell me.

To find out which interpretation is correct, go read it yourself, and come back, and talk. There are a gazillion copies of the Bible out here. Stop being lazy.
I'm asking you. What was the result of your investigation of their interpretations?

I'm not lazy, I'm disinterested. You're the believer, so I figured this would be something you would have considered already.
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Old 02-05-2013, 10:15 PM   #281
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Has science detected God yet via the scientific method?
You made a statement: "God simply cannot be detected like we would detect things in out natural world". I'm asking you how you came to this conclusion. Are you citing your faith in Science as the reason? Now I'm confused as to where your faith lies, at least when science and faith/religion come in conflict.
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Old 02-05-2013, 10:22 PM   #282
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I'm asking you. What was the result of your investigation of their interpretations?
I don't know anything about them nor their interpretation and frankly am "disinterested" in it as well, to be honest. All sarcasm aside.

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I'm not lazy, I'm disinterested. You're the believer, so I figured this would be something you would have considered already.
You're wrong. I didn't consider it.
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Old 02-05-2013, 10:23 PM   #283
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I will if you let me know what kind/type of proof would be sufficent enough for you so that I could know where to start.
What is Proof to you?

How do you know "God" exists?
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Old 02-05-2013, 10:24 PM   #284
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The world is filled with invisible pink unicorns. They are dancing on top of your monitor right now.

They're just not "detectable by the scientific method".

I'd still love to know why this apparently "undetectable" God is described as being very "detectable" in the Big Book O' Myths, which we were all just told is "historically accurate".

Is God out for a really long lunch or something?
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Old 02-05-2013, 10:29 PM   #285
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The world is filled with invisible pink unicorns. They are dancing on top of your monitor right now.

They're just not "detectable by the scientific method".
Show me a ~2000 year old book that says it's true and then I'll believe it.
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Old 02-05-2013, 10:33 PM   #286
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What is Proof to you?

How do you know "God" exists?
You're asking a question I already answered. Read back several pages, come to your own conclusions.
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Old 02-05-2013, 10:35 PM   #287
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Show me a ~2000 year old book that says it's true and then I'll believe it.
Would a book claiming to be 2000 years old be sufficient?
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Old 02-05-2013, 10:38 PM   #288
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To find out which interpretation is correct, go read it yourself, and come back, and talk. There are a gazillion copies of the Bible out here. Stop being lazy.
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I don't know anything about them nor their interpretation and frankly am "disinterested" in it as well, to be honest. All sarcasm aside.

You're wrong. I didn't consider it.
I guess I'm mostly wondering why you think you got it right (assuming you have), the interpretation that is. Again, I'm assuming there is a "correct" interpretation, or at least a mostly correct one, since there appears to be a unique interpretation out there for each of those "gazillion" Bibles.

That's why I asked you about your opinion on the Westboro Baptist Church (the "God Hates Fags" church). You said I was lazy for not looking into it, but I'm just wondering how extensive your quest/efforts have been in discovering the "right" interpretation. Considering it's your personal eternity you're gambling with, which has got to be a helluva lot longer than your existence here on earth, I would think that search would continue for life. Have you already stopped looking? Have you settled into a permanent interpretation?
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Old 02-05-2013, 10:43 PM   #289
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Show me a ~2000 year old book that says it's true and then I'll believe it.
You must have faith. Proof is for sissy scientists.
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Old 02-05-2013, 10:43 PM   #290
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I guess I'm mostly wondering why you think you got it right (assuming you have), the interpretation that is. Again, I'm assuming there is a "correct" interpretation, or at least a mostly correct one, since there appears to be a unique interpretation out there for each of those "gazillion" Bibles.

That's why I asked you about your opinion on the Westboro Baptist Church (the "God Hates Fags" church). You said I was lazy for not looking into it, but I'm just wondering how extensive your quest/efforts have been in discovering the "right" interpretation. Considering it's your personal eternity you're gambling with, which has got to be a helluva lot longer than your existence here on earth, I would think that search would continue for life. Have you already stopped looking? Have you settled into a permanent interpretation?
In my eyes, a Bible is a Bible. www.biblegateway.com has a bunch of them. I don't know what Bible they use, I just read through different ones.

I don't think I got it right, I'm reading it to determine that.
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Old 02-05-2013, 10:46 PM   #291
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Books the Roman empire didn't like so not gosphel


[The Gospel of Mary]
Chapter 4
(Pages 1 to 6 of the manuscript, containing chapters 1 - 3, are lost. The extant text starts on page 7...)

. . . Will matter then be destroyed or not?

22) The Savior said, All nature, all formations, all creatures exist in and with one another, and they will be resolved again into their own roots.

23) For the nature of matter is resolved into the roots of its own nature alone.

24) He who has ears to hear, let him hear.

25) Peter said to him, Since you have explained everything to us, tell us this also: What is the sin of the world?

26) The Savior said There is no sin, but it is you who make sin when you do the things that are like the nature of adultery, which is called sin.

27) That is why the Good came into your midst, to the essence of every nature in order to restore it to its root.

28) Then He continued and said, That is why you become sick and die, for you are deprived of the one who can heal you.

29) He who has a mind to understand, let him understand.

30) Matter gave birth to a passion that has no equal, which proceeded from something contrary to nature. Then there arises a disturbance in its whole body.

31) That is why I said to you, Be of good courage, and if you are discouraged be encouraged in the presence of the different forms of nature.

32) He who has ears to hear, let him hear.

33) When the Blessed One had said this, He greeted them all,saying, Peace be with you. Receive my peace unto yourselves.

34) Beware that no one lead you astray saying Lo here or lo there! For the Son of Man is within you.

35) Follow after Him!

36) Those who seek Him will find Him.

37) Go then and preach the gospel of the Kingdom.

38) Do not lay down any rules beyond what I appointed you, and do not give a law like the lawgiver lest you be constrained by it.

39) When He said this He departed.


Chapter 5
1) But they were grieved. They wept greatly, saying, How shall we go to the Gentiles and preach the gospel of the Kingdom of the Son of Man? If they did not spare Him, how will they spare us?

2) Then Mary stood up, greeted them all, and said to her brethren, Do not weep and do not grieve nor be irresolute, for His grace will be entirely with you and will protect you.

3) But rather, let us praise His greatness, for He has prepared us and made us into Men.

4) When Mary said this, she turned their hearts to the Good, and they began to discuss the words of the Savior.

5) Peter said to Mary, Sister we know that the Savior loved you more than the rest of woman.

6) Tell us the words of the Savior which you remember which you know, but we do not, nor have we heard them.

7) Mary answered and said, What is hidden from you I will proclaim to you.

8) And she began to speak to them these words: I, she said, I saw the Lord in a vision and I said to Him, Lord I saw you today in a vision. He answered and said to me,

9) Blessed are you that you did not waver at the sight of Me. For where the mind is there is the treasure.

10) I said to Him, Lord, how does he who sees the vision see it, through the soul or through the spirit?

11) The Savior answered and said, He does not see through the soul nor through the spirit, but the mind that is between the two that is what sees the vision and it is [...]

(pages 11 - 14 are missing from the manuscript)


Chapter 8:
. . . it.

10) And desire said, I did not see you descending, but now I see you ascending. Why do you lie since you belong to me?

11) The soul answered and said, I saw you. You did not see me nor recognize me. I served you as a garment and you did not know me.

12) When it said this, it (the soul) went away rejoicing greatly.

13) Again it came to the third power, which is called ignorance.

14) The power questioned the soul, saying, Where are you going? In wickedness are you bound. But you are bound; do not judge!

15) And the soul said, Why do you judge me, although I have not judged?

16) I was bound, though I have not bound.

17) I was not recognized. But I have recognized that the All is being dissolved, both the earthly things and the heavenly.

18) When the soul had overcome the third power, it went upwards and saw the fourth power, which took seven forms.

19) The first form is darkness, the second desire, the third ignorance, the fourth is the excitement of death, the fifth is the kingdom of the flesh, the sixth is the foolish wisdom of flesh, the seventh is the wrathful wisdom. These are the seven powers of wrath.

20) They asked the soul, Whence do you come slayer of men, or where are you going, conqueror of space?

21) The soul answered and said, What binds me has been slain, and what turns me about has been overcome,

22) and my desire has been ended, and ignorance has died.

23) In a aeon I was released from a world, and in a Type from a type, and from the fetter of oblivion which is transient.

24) From this time on will I attain to the rest of the time, of the season, of the aeon, in silence.


Chapter 9
1) When Mary had said this, she fell silent, since it was to this point that the Savior had spoken with her.

2) But Andrew answered and said to the brethren, Say what you wish to say about what she has said. I at least do not believe that the Savior said this. For certainly these teachings are strange ideas.

3) Peter answered and spoke concerning these same things.

4) He questioned them about the Savior: Did He really speak privately with a woman and not openly to us? Are we to turn about and all listen to her? Did He prefer her to us?

5) Then Mary wept and said to Peter, My brother Peter, what do you think? Do you think that I have thought this up myself in my heart, or that I am lying about the Savior?

6) Levi answered and said to Peter, Peter you have always been hot tempered.

7) Now I see you contending against the woman like the adversaries.

8) But if the Savior made her worthy, who are you indeed to reject her? Surely the Savior knows her very well.

9) That is why He loved her more than us. Rather let us be ashamed and put on the perfect Man, and separate as He commanded us and preach the gospel, not laying down any other rule or other law beyond what the Savior said.

10) And when they heard this they began to go forth to proclaim and to preach.


The Gospel According to Mary



I see you guys like talking Science here are words from a woman 2000 years ago . It gives me goosebumps The science thats in here . Now Imagine A system entering the event horizon of a black whole Pretty much what one would expect to see in science isn't it . Matter Aeon . Also note The soul and the spirit are in the same place , Its as I have told you many times SOUL= Flesh . The Spirit Is the Spirit and it doesn't belong exclusively to you . It is Christ or god in all men. Why this things are hidden is pretty easy to understand if your on the A team . If your a monkey it may be beyond your capacity to comprehend .

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Old 02-06-2013, 12:41 AM   #292
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(snip)

I see you guys like talking Science here are words from a woman 2000 years ago . It gives me goosebumps The science thats in here . Now Imagine A system entering the event horizon of a black whole Pretty much what one would expect to see in science isn't it . Matter Aeon . Also note The soul and the spirit are in the same place , Its as I have told you many times SOUL= Flesh . The Spirit Is the Spirit and it doesn't belong exclusively to you . It is Christ or god in all men. Why this things are hidden is pretty easy to understand if your on the A team . If your a monkey it may be beyond your capacity to comprehend .
Being closer related to the Chimp than a Monkey, I suppose I may be more able to comprehend your attempt to ordain 'Mary's' gospel as authoritative. Or even that the analogy can be construed as you proclaim...

My questions would be: Since what you listed is not considered inspired by God, apparently, what value do you assign to it? Had every invitee attend the various settings to discuss these issues do you speculate on the outcome had they done so and do you think it was the will of God that they didn't all attend... Especially as it relates to the Divinity of Jesus from the First (Inspired?) Meeting in Nicaea given Your 'Mary' gospel seems to refer to Jesus as sorta special to her and the apostles. And finally, Since you assign the Spirit sorta on loan from God or at least shared, do you think folks having such might be preordained to accept as truth the writings of the bible (and the non biblical writings if you want) than those whose Spirit is corrupted by the reality they see about them?

As an after thought, are your goose bumps similar to Chris Mathews' 'tingling' up his leg over Obama? I get goose bumps when I'm cold so I'm trying to relate to your experience.
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Old 02-06-2013, 01:12 AM   #293
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You want to debate something like this you best bring alot more than this to the Table . I suppose the Gosphel of peter is bogus also . PAUL was never an Apostle its a HRCC lie . Paul also goes against Christ own words . None can Attain Heaven least it come threw me . THE Paul Like another man in history was saved by the Holy spirit According to paul . Christ and The Spirit are opposing each other here . I think not ROME lied.

http://www.columbia.edu/cu/augustine...andt/nicea.htm ROME the evil emperior had alot more to do with the Church and what went into the New testiment than you can imagine . The council was set up in Roman forum type. What went in and what didn't go in . Now this info is small comparred to what you can attain from any catholic school . In first grade the vary first religion lessons we recieved were about the Semerians . Imagine that . They also taught us this was were the eden was located. You going to come to a gun fight with a knife don't waste my time
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Old 02-06-2013, 01:17 AM   #294
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Being closer related to the Chimp than a Monkey, I suppose I may be more able to comprehend your attempt to ordain 'Mary's' gospel as authoritative. Or even that the analogy can be construed as you proclaim...

My questions would be: Since what you listed is not considered inspired by God, apparently, what value do you assign to it? Had every invitee attend the various settings to discuss these issues do you speculate on the outcome had they done so and do you think it was the will of God that they didn't all attend... Especially as it relates to the Divinity of Jesus from the First (Inspired?) Meeting in Nicaea given Your 'Mary' gospel seems to refer to Jesus as sorta special to her and the apostles. And finally, Since you assign the Spirit sorta on loan from God or at least shared, do you think folks having such might be preordained to accept as truth the writings of the bible (and the non biblical writings if you want) than those whose Spirit is corrupted by the reality they see about them?

As an after thought, are your goose bumps similar to Chris Mathews' 'tingling' up his leg over Obama? I get goose bumps when I'm cold so I'm trying to relate to your experience.
I will lay wages you are not RH negitive blood . This blood type is the only type that doesn't contain Rhesus monkey dna. So you stand corrected
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Old 02-06-2013, 01:41 AM   #295
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You know about Enoch write did you know it to was in the Torah but removed it was in the Roman bible (Jersulem Bible) also removed . Bless the works and wonders of man . It still to this day is in one bible . The Ethiopic version does how ever. The book of jjude quotes Enoch and that is good enough for me . Enoch was a decendent of cain is that not ass stomping?

Now back to the Rhesus Monkey blood 85% of all humans have . I will start you on the easy things that are easily understood by none monkeys . I know you will have a hard time wrapping your tail around this but do try .

http://www.lavistachurchofchrist.org...ookOfEnoch.htm

In a debate like this I always help my opponent just to even things up a bit .

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Old 02-06-2013, 02:19 AM   #296
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You want to debate something like this you best bring alot more than this to the Table . I suppose the Gosphel of peter is bogus also . PAUL was never an Apostle its a HRCC lie . Paul also goes against Christ own words . None can Attain Heaven least it come threw me . THE Paul Like another man in history was saved by the Holy spirit According to paul . Christ and The Spirit are opposing each other here . I think not ROME lied.

http://www.columbia.edu/cu/augustine...andt/nicea.htm ROME the evil emperior had alot more to do with the Church and what went into the New testiment than you can imagine . The council was set up in Roman forum type. What went in and what didn't go in . Now this info is small comparred to what you can attain from any catholic school . In first grade the vary first religion lessons we recieved were about the Semerians . Imagine that . They also taught us this was were the eden was located. You going to come to a gun fight with a knife don't waste my time
I won't waste your time and neither would I bring a gun or knife if I were to entertain a fight... You seem able to engage both sides and I'll await the victor.
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Old 02-06-2013, 02:31 AM   #297
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I will lay wages you are not RH negitive blood . This blood type is the only type that doesn't contain Rhesus monkey dna. So you stand corrected
Nope! I'm O+ and I'm closer related to the Chimp and Bonobo than to you, apparently. Well... according to the evolutionary biologists that I consulted when I found I really liked chimp food.
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Old 02-06-2013, 02:44 AM   #298
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You know about Enoch write did you know it to was in the Torah but removed it was in the Roman bible (Jersulem Bible) also removed . Bless the works and wonders of man . It still to this day is in one bible . The Ethiopic version does how ever. The book of jjude quotes Enoch and that is good enough for me . Enoch was a decendent of cain is that not ass stomping?

Now back to the Rhesus Monkey blood 85% of all humans have . I will start you on the easy things that are easily understood by none monkeys . I know you will have a hard time wrapping your tail around this but do try .

http://www.lavistachurchofchrist.org...ookOfEnoch.htm

In a debate like this I always help my opponent just to even things up a bit .
Assuming Noah and Mrs Noah are related to Adam, Eve and the boys... through Grandpa Enoch... hmmm.... Did Eve mess with Cain or did he find a cute monkey? Anyhow, I don't know much about those books Moses wrote or what Enoch wrote but I did see the movie with Chuck Heston being Moses if that counts and the script writer must have left that bit about Enoch liking monkeys out... or I was after pop corn when it was discussed.

Well, it is nice of you to provide help to this intellectually starved ape. I don't seem to have a tail so I'm hard pressed to consider myself competent to sail about in your tree.
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Old 02-06-2013, 03:01 AM   #299
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Nope! I'm O+ and I'm closer related to the Chimp and Bonobo than to you, apparently. Well... according to the evolutionary biologists that I consulted when I found I really liked chimp food.
Doesn't change the fact your monkey blood was attained in a differant manner than was your ape genes we all have. Would you like me to explain how YOUR ancestor got Monkey blood , Do I really have to draw you a picture . A rightious man would never do to a monkey what your ancestors did .
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Old 02-06-2013, 03:12 AM   #300
Nemesis 1
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Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,379
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LunarRay View Post
Assuming Noah and Mrs Noah are related to Adam, Eve and the boys... through Grandpa Enoch... hmmm.... Did Eve mess with Cain or did he find a cute monkey? Anyhow, I don't know much about those books Moses wrote or what Enoch wrote but I did see the movie with Chuck Heston being Moses if that counts and the script writer must have left that bit about Enoch liking monkeys out... or I was after pop corn when it was discussed.

Well, it is nice of you to provide help to this intellectually starved ape. I don't seem to have a tail so I'm hard pressed to consider myself competent to sail about in your tree.
You don't get it NOAH was a mistake . A minor god disobeyed the commanders order and told Noah to build an Ark . god the commander already had the new seed on board his ship. The none monkey blood types only 2, 1 male Enoch 1 female Lilith .
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