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Old 01-26-2013, 08:52 AM   #1
Hellhammer
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Default Looking for new speakers

Been thinking about getting new speakers for a while but I think it's finally time to actually do something about it. So, I currently have Logitech's Z-10 speakers, which are not bad for being 2.0. However, I'd appreciate some more kick because especially the bass is pretty bad due to lack of separate subwoofer.

I mainly use the speakers for listening to music (mainly house/EDM), so this is what matters. I do game and watch movies/TV every now and then but I've found the Z-10s to be fine for that purpose. Just to clarify, these will be connected to my desktop, so this is not a home theater setup.

Honestly I'm not a big audio guy so I've no idea what to buy, but I think 2.1 setup is what I should look for. My budget isn't very strict as I don't have a problem spending 300€ on the speakers if they are truly good, but on the other hand I'm not looking for high-end stuff so would like to stay between 100-200€. I'm merely looking for a nice upgrade from my current ones.

Any and all help is appreciated.
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Old 01-26-2013, 09:32 AM   #2
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how much space do you have on your desk? near field monitors might fit your use. I don't know the Finland market, got a website you can link to where we new world netizens can take a look and perhaps recommend models?
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Old 01-26-2013, 10:13 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sdifox View Post
how much space do you have on your desk? near field monitors might fit your use. I don't know the Finland market, got a website you can link to where we new world netizens can take a look and perhaps recommend models?
Here's a picture of my desk (sorry, had to blur the other monitor because I'm running tests that are not ready for public yet):



Here's Google translation of one of the biggest Finnish online stores: http://translate.google.fi/translate...okauppa.com%2F

amazon.co.uk will work too as they might have more universal selection (and cheaper prices).

EDIT: Thomann will also work, they focus on audio products and might have brands that the links above don't.
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Old 01-26-2013, 11:09 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by Hellhammer View Post
Here's a picture of my desk (sorry, had to blur the other monitor because I'm running tests that are not ready for public yet):



Here's Google translation of one of the biggest Finnish online stores: http://translate.google.fi/translate...okauppa.com%2F

amazon.co.uk will work too as they might have more universal selection (and cheaper prices).

EDIT: Thomann will also work, they focus on audio products and might have brands that the links above don't.

Are you able to find a local pro audio store? Maybe listen to this? That price is for EACH speaker.

http://www.thomann.de/gb/krk_rp5_g2_rokit.htm

Your positioning of the speakers is not ideal...
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Old 01-26-2013, 11:29 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by sdifox View Post
Are you able to find a local pro audio store? Maybe listen to this? That price is for EACH speaker.

http://www.thomann.de/gb/krk_rp5_g2_rokit.htm

Your positioning of the speakers is not ideal...
Yeah, I saw those but they might be a bit too expensive (two of those would be +300).

Any thoughts on Behringer's MS40? They are 150 and seem to be fairly popular from what I've googled. I know they probably aren't audiophile's dream speakers, but would fit well in my budget.

Also, how would you position the speakers?
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Old 01-26-2013, 01:27 PM   #6
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OP, you will thank me later for going with a pair of Focal CMS 40 speakers for $850 + shipping. They are small enough and yet weighs a tank and give you good SQ. Its strenth is in the mid range and in the upper registers. Bass is actually solid if you bump up the 32k and 60khz up 3 notches. You can then later pick up an Audioengine S8 subwoofer, it's only 11.5 inches wide and 12 inches tall.

I have a pair of CMS 65's and purchased a $50,000.00 power cord for my A/V equipment. About 5 days to arrival from Sweden. I'm gonna pick up an S8 subwoofer (since it draws little current for optimal sound) so I can use my $1,200 Audioquest Angel 3.5mm mini cable. Oh man I'm so excited!

Cheez
Thanks for the suggestion, but those are way over my budget. Would have to do quite a few SSD reviews to be able to afford something like that
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Old 01-26-2013, 02:37 PM   #7
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Have you considered headphones? (e. g. http://www.innerfidelity.com/content...-master-page-2 & http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lGWB6jcKjAU )

Another good place to ask around is Head-Fi: http://www.head-fi.org/f/

There are lots of members from all around the EU and around the world, so they may also be able to recommend specific products or stores in Finland.
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Old 01-26-2013, 02:42 PM   #8
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Any thoughts on Behringer's MS40? They are 150 and seem to be fairly popular from what I've googled. I know they probably aren't audiophile's dream speakers, but would fit well in my budget.
They're nice, but aren't going to give you your EDM fix of thumping bass. You *really* need to go 2.1 -- preferably in a way that you can upgrade the components later.
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Old 01-26-2013, 02:47 PM   #9
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They're nice, but aren't going to give you your EDM fix of thumping bass. You *really* need to go 2.1 -- preferably in a way that you can upgrade the components later.
Can I add a subwoofer if I buy the Behringers? They are only 150, so I could still afford a subwoofer along with them.
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Old 01-26-2013, 03:20 PM   #10
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Can I add a subwoofer if I buy the Behringers? They are only 150€, so I could still afford a subwoofer along with them.
Yeah, but coordinating the speaker and sub outputs could be an issue. Your desktop photo isn't showing up so I'm not sure what sort of rig/setup this is connecting to.

Also, can you really buy a nice home sub for E150? It's tough in the US from consumer audio brands -- you have to look at sellers like parts-express and Monoprice or go secondhand.

EDIT: Heh, I looked at the Thomann site and your best in-budget upgrade might simply to get this 225euro subwoofer. It has a variable high-pass filter (to direct low stuff to the sub and not to the speakers) so you can just hook them up between your PC and your Logitechs without changing anything else.

You can upgrade with better 2.0 later.

EDIT 2: Oops, the damn Logitechs are USB. Useless!

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Old 01-26-2013, 07:31 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellhammer View Post
Yeah, I saw those but they might be a bit too expensive (two of those would be +300€).

Any thoughts on Behringer's MS40? They are 150€ and seem to be fairly popular from what I've googled. I know they probably aren't audiophile's dream speakers, but would fit well in my budget.

Also, how would you position the speakers?
point them towards your ears for starters

Go to a pro audio shop and listen to speakers. What I like may not be your taste at all.

I do love them Rokit5s


Ignore cheez please.
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Old 01-27-2013, 05:22 AM   #12
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Yeah, but coordinating the speaker and sub outputs could be an issue. Your desktop photo isn't showing up so I'm not sure what sort of rig/setup this is connecting to.
It should be up now, not sure why it went down at some point. Anyway, it's a typical custom PC with AsRock Z68 Pro3.

Quote:
Also, can you really buy a nice home sub for E150? It's tough in the US from consumer audio brands -- you have to look at sellers like parts-express and Monoprice or go secondhand.
The beauty of a sub would be that I can buy it later on. I'm sure nearly any set of speakers will be an upgrade from my current ones, so I'm not sure I'll even need a sub. The sub you linked is an active one, right? So wouldn't it be rather easy to connect it to for example the Behringers?
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Old 01-27-2013, 10:40 AM   #13
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I too was going to suggest you look at some AudioEngine speakers. But I didn't see them on the website you posted. For the size and price the AudioEngine 5's are probably the best speakers I've heard. And I've got some KRK Rockit 6's and Rockit 8's.
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Old 01-27-2013, 11:49 AM   #14
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It should be up now, not sure why it went down at some point. Anyway, it's a typical custom PC with AsRock Z68 Pro3.
I'm pretty sure it's a dropbox link that only *you* have permissions to see. Whoops.
Quote:
The beauty of a sub would be that I can buy it later on. I'm sure nearly any set of speakers will be an upgrade from my current ones, so I'm not sure I'll even need a sub. The sub you linked is an active one, right? So wouldn't it be rather easy to connect it to for example the Behringers?
Well, it's not the connection per se, it's the crossover.

There are four ways to transition from the low end of the speakers to where the sub plays *its* low tones:
(1)(a) Active crossover in an AVR. This is the classic HT setup: one box handles the processing, splits off all the low stuff into the sub channel, and sends both a powered (speaker-level) signal to the speakers and the line-level signal to the sub. The cleanest option, but AVRs tend to be too big for desktop setup.
(b) You can *also* do this from inside a desktop PC (instead of an AVR) if you're willing to control all volume from the PC and not through the speakers/amp.
(2) Line-level high-pass filter in the sub. Here you run the signal to the sub, then the sub filters out the low stuff for itself and passes the rest to line-level outputs for the amp/active speakers. The Samson sub I linked can do this.
(3) Speaker-level high-pass filter in the sub. Same thing as (2) except you're running powered speaker-level wire all around (from amp->sub->speakers) instead of line-level RCA (or XLR, but you won't use XLR).
(4) Nothing. Have 'em both try to play bass, hope your sub fades out (maybe by adjusting its low-pass filter) where your speakers fade in and vice versa.

Getting active 2.0 speakers eliminates (3) and probably (1)(a) (only expensive AVRs have pre-outs to which you can connect active fronts). I guess the fact that you have that reasonably-priced sub option that allows (2) makes this a not-huge issue, though.

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Old 01-27-2013, 02:06 PM   #15
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I too was going to suggest you look at some AudioEngine speakers. But I didn't see them on the website you posted. For the size and price the AudioEngine 5's are probably the best speakers I've heard. And I've got some KRK Rockit 6's and Rockit 8's.
Yeah, unfortunately the official Finnish dealer for AudioEngine is in Norway, and their current price is 5000NOK, or about 400 euros.
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Old 01-27-2013, 02:31 PM   #16
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Yeah, unfortunately the official Finnish dealer for AudioEngine is in Norway, and their current price is 5000NOK, or about 400 euros.
There are a few resellers that sell them for ~230 though. They are ~200 in Amazon.co.uk as well. Seriously thinking if I should go with them, gets pretty good reviews and the price is not outrageous.
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Old 01-27-2013, 02:56 PM   #17
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If you can get it at that price, do so. Most of the alternatives would involve larger speakers that start to strain the whole "desk" concept.

EDIT: I hope you aren't looking at the Audioengine 2, though. Those will *not* satisfy your need for low end sans subwoofer.

Ha ha, just checked Amazon and you were. I knew you couldn't get them that much cheaper there than here.

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Old 01-28-2013, 01:00 AM   #18
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OP, you will thank me later for going with a pair of Focal CMS 40 speakers for $850 + shipping. They are small enough and yet weighs a tank and give you good SQ. Its strenth is in the mid range and in the upper registers. Bass is actually solid if you bump up the 32hz and 60hz up 3 notches. You can then later pick up an Audioengine S8 subwoofer, it's only 11.5 inches wide and 12 inches tall.

I have a pair of CMS 65's and purchased a $50,000.00 power cord for my A/V equipment. About 5 days to arrival from Sweden. I'm gonna pick up an S8 subwoofer (since it draws little current for optimal sound) so I can use my $1,200 Audioquest Angel 3.5mm mini cable. Oh man I'm so excited!

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Old 01-28-2013, 01:05 AM   #19
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Quick question: would you be able to get a cheap AV receiver to use? Almost anything could work as long as it has S/P-DIF/analog inputs and an LFE output, e.g. anything from the last 15 years. Maybe you know a buddy who's upgrading, or perhaps there's a garage sale down the street? Having something like that would greatly increase your options.

Assuming that you CAN get something like that, I would strongly recommend something like this:

http://www.amazon.com/Behringer-B203.../dp/B000LQ2ABK

This is the passive version, since the active version costs a lot more. If you have the receiver then that can supply power anyway, and the LFE channel opens up the possibility of adding sub(s) later as necessary. The 8" woofer gives a pretty decent low-end; I've run it down to about 40 Hz full-scale and it seems to be OK for most types of music. Would be worlds better than what you have now anyway.

See below for more info:

http://www.zaphaudio.com/blog.html (search for "B2031P")
http://dtmblabber.blogspot.ca/2010_07_01_archive.html

The KRK Rokit 6 is not much more in terms of $$ and is likely to be similar in terms of SQ but it doesn't produce as much bass due to its smaller woofer.
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Old 01-28-2013, 09:28 AM   #20
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OP, the A2 speakers actually has plenty of bass. They are front ported, and are designed to help increase bass further if you place them close to the wall. Their mid/low is very detailed. I remember the guy that recommended me this. His name is runawayprisoner.
Generally front ported speakers make them less dependent about distance from the wall. Thats why I generally try to pick front ported speakers.
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Old 01-28-2013, 09:52 AM   #21
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I don't have a set of the A2's. It could also be argued that having them that far back on a wooden desk is going to make it sound worse than having them away from the wall.
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Old 01-28-2013, 11:12 AM   #22
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Quick question: would you be able to get a cheap AV receiver to use? Almost anything could work as long as it has S/P-DIF/analog inputs and an LFE output, e.g. anything from the last 15 years. Maybe you know a buddy who's upgrading, or perhaps there's a garage sale down the street? Having something like that would greatly increase your options.

Assuming that you CAN get something like that, I would strongly recommend something like this:

http://www.amazon.com/Behringer-B203.../dp/B000LQ2ABK
It'll definitely work, and it's better than listening to the crazy person in this thread, but you're really advocating a desk-busting maximalist approach.

Unfortunately, with audio it's really a matter of price, quality, and size -- choose two. With the OP really limited on cost, letting the size balloon may be the best option. Still for nearfield I'd probably choose a cute little T-amp over a big AVR...
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Old 01-28-2013, 02:08 PM   #23
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It'll definitely work, and it's better than listening to the crazy person in this thread, but you're really advocating a desk-busting maximalist approach.

Unfortunately, with audio it's really a matter of price, quality, and size -- choose two. With the OP really limited on cost, letting the size balloon may be the best option. Still for nearfield I'd probably choose a cute little T-amp over a big AVR...
I don't disagree. But, if you espouse KISS then an AVR really is the best thing he can do for a separate sub output.

In any case, the B2031P does have decent bass.
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Old 01-28-2013, 02:13 PM   #24
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OP, the A2 speakers actually has plenty of bass. They are front ported, and are designed to help increase bass further if you place them close to the wall. Their mid/low is very detailed. I remember the guy that recommended me this. His name is runawayprisoner.

Please ignore what Howard said about the stupid receivers... No need to go passive. They sound worse and take up more room.

cheez
1) Nobody gives a crap about runaway prisoner.
2) All speakers will effectively produce more bass if they placed closer to more boundaries (walls and corners).
3) He is not interested in better mids and lows, even if your crappy speakers were good at them.
4) I agree that they might take up more room, especially if a receiver is used for amplification. However, in this price range, active will not sound any better than passive.

PM me if you want to discuss the technical stuff. I may or may not respond.
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Old 01-28-2013, 04:20 PM   #25
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A bit OT, but my god, that Coconut Audio site is hilarious. One of the more ambitious audiophile trolling efforts I've every seen. I wonder if people actually try to order their "products". Well played, Mr. Coconut.
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