New 128gb SSD advice (M4 vs Sammy 840 vs Vertex 4)

[jwilliams4200]

Why take the risk? Go with a more stable company like Samsung or Plextor.

And why ask again when it is already discussed in the thread you linked?

[Mfusick]

What risk ???

There is no risk.

[Mfusick]

Originally Posted by goodwidp

Thanks very much for the continued replies. I'm getting close to pulling the trigger on one of these drives.

I noticed a thread about OCZ on here and was wondering if that should change my thinking on purchasing the V4 (or any OCZ drive for that matter).

Link: http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2275812

Basically it mentions that OCZ is struggling financially, so the worry becomes not having a warranty honored if anything were to happen to the drive in the next 5 years and the company is no longer around. I realize the info in the thread is pretty much all speculation, but it was enough to make me hesitant about making the purchase. Does anyone think that's something to be genuinely concerned about or is it nothing? Thanks again.

Its pure BS.

As little a difference in real world performance from one drive to another negates that factor in making a choice.... This concern is a million times less important and speculative.

It shouldn't have an effect on your decision. It's very unlikely you'll lose your warranty on Vertex 4.

It's even more unlikely it will fail or you will even need the warranty.

V4 is a proven winner.

Using this info to turn to a crappier Crucial is big mistake IMO.

[josephjpeters]

Originally Posted by Mfusick

Using this info to turn to a crappier Crucial is big mistake IMO.

A drive that is about to be EOL, nonetheless.

[Torn Mind]

OCZ cannot be trusted yet. Get the Crucial.

[Mfusick]

Originally Posted by josephjpeters

A drive that is about to be EOL, nonetheless.

I just don't see how Crucial is going to compete with Samsung and OCZ given they have an old ordinary controller- while OCZ and Samsung both own controller companies and/or make and design their own controllers.

In the issue of the Vertex4 vs M4 - they actually both use the same controller (marvel) so it's plain silly to think the reliability on hardware level would be any different.

The different is in the firmware- where the V4 takes a big step forward because of advancements in this area.

If your judging reliability here- Vertex4 has huge advantage as it's been proven reliable. Sure Vertex4 had a firmware update come out- but it was aimed at increasing the performance of the drive.

M4 had a serious firmware issue where 100% of all Crucial M4's would BSOD blue screen of death error. Kudos to Crucial for updating the firmware and fixing that problem.

But if your keeping score- the Vertex4 is as solid as the M4 at reliability. It's not a new drive. There is tons of them out there. Most report good feedback and that drive has a good reputation.

The OCZ hate is on the older OCZ products and the Sandforce based SSD's (not the VERTEX4). It does not apply to the V4.

Considering V4 is cheaper/faster/longer warranty.... Has good NAND inside and has proven reliability on par with M4 or 840 (V4 been out a while, its not new)- I can't understand comments like the post above makes.

They make no sense.

It just shows how much the old reputation from old products carries over- and how many people just regurgitate the hate on OCZ because it is trendy.
Less than 1 out of 10 OCZ bashers has actually owned a recent model OCZ drive - let alone had any issues with one.

There is tons of happy OCZ owners around here with Vertex4's

I would post the same thing about Crucial as the poster above did about OCZ but I realize M4 is a decent drive. While it might have had a BSOD firmware bug, and it's older and slow with inferior controller- Real world it's not a big deal and for the most part it's a good drive with decent reliability.

I doubt OP will know the difference between any of them once he gets and installs so just buy what you like.

There is a lot of propaganda that gets mixed into the facts so it's all a grey area with no right or wrong choice.

I'm just playing devils advocate because I see the big picture.

[Mfusick]

Originally Posted by Torn Mind

OCZ cannot be trusted yet. Get the Crucial.

says the guy with a HDD in his signature....

[Torn Mind]

Sorry buddy, but I have had the experience of an OCZ dying on me. It wasn't mine. Someone asked me to fix up a keyboard issue. The computer booted up fine twice. But when I finally fixed the keyboard issue(connectors loose), the drive was a dead one. That was an Agility Plus R2, which has an Indilinx controller, not a Sandforce. OCZ is trash, and until a good two years pass, their reputation deserves to eat into their sales.

[josephjpeters]

Originally Posted by Mfusick

I just don't see how Crucial is going to compete with Samsung and OCZ given they have an old ordinary controller- while OCZ and Samsung both own controller companies and/or make and design their own controllers.

In the issue of the Vertex4 vs M4 - they actually both use the same controller (marvel) so it's plain silly to think the reliability on hardware level would be any different.

The different is in the firmware- where the V4 takes a big step forward because of advancements in this area.

If your judging reliability here- Vertex4 has huge advantage as it's been proven reliable. Sure Vertex4 had a firmware update come out- but it was aimed at increasing the performance of the drive.

M4 had a serious firmware issue where 100% of all Crucial M4's would BSOD blue screen of death error. Kudos to Crucial for updating the firmware and fixing that problem.

But if your keeping score- the Vertex4 is as solid as the M4 at reliability. It's not a new drive. There is tons of them out there. Most report good feedback and that drive has a good reputation.

The OCZ hate is on the older OCZ products and the Sandforce based SSD's (not the VERTEX4). It does not apply to the V4.

Considering V4 is cheaper/faster/longer warranty.... Has good NAND inside and has proven reliability on par with M4 or 840 (V4 been out a while, its not new)- I can't understand comments like the post above makes.

They make no sense.

It just shows how much the old reputation from old products carries over- and how many people just regurgitate the hate on OCZ because it is trendy.
Less than 1 out of 10 OCZ bashers has actually owned a recent model OCZ drive - let alone had any issues with one.

There is tons of happy OCZ owners around here with Vertex4's

I would post the same thing about Crucial as the poster above did about OCZ but I realize M4 is a decent drive. While it might have had a BSOD firmware bug, and it's older and slow with inferior controller- Real world it's not a big deal and for the most part it's a good drive with decent reliability.

I doubt OP will know the difference between any of them once he gets and installs so just buy what you like.

There is a lot of propaganda that gets mixed into the facts so it's all a grey area with no right or wrong choice.

I'm just playing devils advocate because I see the big picture.

lol you're so going to get flamed on for this.

I agree with most of what you said. Although Micron doesn't own their own controller, they supposedly write their own FW and they make their own NAND so that is quite a competitive advantage. It seems their strategy is to win based on price now and when you start doing that reliability take a little bit of a hit because you're using lesser quality parts and skimping on things. Want a recent example? Go look at the Crucial V4. Everyone says Crucial is so reliable but no one wants to talk about Crucial's most recent drive (until the newly announced M500) that uses a JMicron part. It's a terrible drive but using a POS controller and suspect parts was the only way they can win on price.

[Arkaign]

Fwiw, I just went from a 256GB OCZ Vertex 4 to a 250GB Samsung 840. Benches didn't go up an extreme amount, but it was basically a free upgrade so I went for it. I understand that the smaller 840 isn't nearly as good as the 250/500 versions.

I liked my Vertex 4 though, mine had no issues after about 6 months of hard use, my PN was VTX4-25SAT3-256G. I tried to update the firmware when I bought it, but it might have been too new. Regardless, it never failed me. Hopefully I have the same luck with this 840.

[Hellhammer]

Originally Posted by Mfusick

I just don't see how Crucial is going to compete with Samsung and OCZ given they have an old ordinary controller- while OCZ and Samsung both own controller companies and/or make and design their own controllers.

Price. In the end, it's not about the controller or performance - if your price is good enough, people will buy it. As NAND makes most of the BOM of an SSD, manufacturing your NAND offers a huge pricing advantage (NAND still has fairly big profits).

OCZ doesn't have a NAND fab, which puts them at the mercy of other manufacturers. Buying in huge volumes will of course help but actual NAND manufacturers still have an advantage (it's very unlikely that they would sell NAND at a loss or significantly below average market prices). OCZ has had NAND supply issues in the past, so this is an aspect that should be considered too.

IMO, NAND manufacturing is more important than making your own controller, which is why Crucial is a player that should not be forgotten.

Originally Posted by josephjpeters

Go look at the Crucial V4. Everyone says Crucial is so reliable but no one wants to talk about Crucial's most recent drive (until the newly announced M500) that uses a JMicron part.

The controller is Phison to be exact (although honestly I don't think it makes any difference, it's still bad).

[goodwidp]

Finally made a decision and ended up going with the 128gb Plextor M5 Pro. It cost a tiny bit more but I really liked the reviews I've read for it in addition to the 5 yr warranty and Plextor's very good reputation. I can't thank everyone enough for all of their input and advice in this thread and similar threads on this forum. I really feel as if I learned quite a bit in this process and much of that knowledge came from the friendly folks here. Thanks again all, I sincerely appreciate it.

[Ao1]

Originally Posted by josephjpeters

Vertex 4 because it uses MLC and has a 5 year warranty.

And because you have a vested long term financial interest in OCZ?

http://finance.yahoo.com/mbview/user...ef3dfa147&lv=s

[CKCalmer]

After the fact, I know, but I have some recent experience that may be important to anyone else who may find this thread from a web search.

I own a business that purchased several hundred SSDs in February and March of this year (2013) for deployment in desktop systems across the company. The purchases included 240 OCZ Vector 128GB SSDs, and 193 Plextor M5 Pro 128GB SSDs.

Within the first two weeks after implementation, 104 of the OCZ SSDs were dead. That's a 43% hard failure rate. Not a single Plextor SSD has failed as yet. It's still too early for us to judge the reliability of the Plextor SSDs over time. But we can say that their 30-day failure rate is obviously far below that of the OCZ products.

We made the purchases from several different vendors to mitigate the risk of a single vendor having a bulk of same-lot products which might suffer a version-specific reliability issue. We upgraded to the latest firmware on all SSDs we deployed. All the PCs involved operate in ambient air temperatures of 68-70F, all of them have active air cooling in their cases and all their cases are opened and carefully cleaned every quarter. All the failures occurred more than 24 hours after the firmware updates (i.e., we suffered no firmware re-write failures).

Needless to say, I will not be able to recommend an OCZ Vector, at least in the 128GB capacity, for a while. As for the Plex M5Ps, I've just purchased one for each of my three home desktop PCs.

[Mfusick]

Originally Posted by josephjpeters

Vertex 4 because it uses MLC and has a 5 year warranty.

I'd then say 840 (its a new drive using a really great controller but TLC NAND) followed by the M4 (it's pretty old at this point and it's only a 3 year warranty).

This*

Vertex 4. Then Sammy (with lesser NAND).

I'd light my reproductive organ on fire and put out that fire with a sledge hammer over using a Crucial M4. It's easily the most overrated SSD ever sold. It's not cheaper, it's not faster, and its not more reliable.

Those are facts.

In before some owners spread propaganda to defend their purchase decision and promote an SSD that's years old generation in design and performance.

[sequoia464]

Originally Posted by Mfusick

I'd light my reproductive organ on fire and put out that fire with a sledge hammer over using a Crucial M4. It's easily the most overrated SSD ever sold. It's not cheaper, it's not faster, and its not more reliable.

Probably want to get that on video, some news agencies would pay good money for that.

Seriously though, I have quite a few drives including Plextors, Intels and three M4's - no complaints with any, only failure was with one Plextor. However, I got a 256 830 Samsung recently, and cloned an older drive on to it - I was amazed at how much faster that went than with some of the other drives.

Edit on the failures - also had a Vertex 2 go belly up. That one cost me some time, happened to be on a raided set that my operating system was on - the day before leaving on a vacation.

[davelpg]

I will only speak to the SSD I own and use, the Crucial M4. No complaints. While some others here seem to hate the thing, I gotta wonder if they've actually owned one.

Probably not much wrong with the other SSDs mentioned here either. Probably.