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Old 01-07-2013, 01:34 PM   #76
tviceman
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I'm not personally interested, but as long as it makes good money I don't really care. If it fails to generate profits, I will be slightly upset.
Spoken like a true shareholder! Hahaha seriously though, I don't see it selling through the roof, but like I said earlier in the thread, I can see gamer parents getting this for their kid so the kid isn't always using daddy's phone but can play all the cheap/free games he likes on dad's phone. Then when little johnny is sleeping, dad has s new gadget to play with.


If the often rumored steam console comes out, I see that as being the potentially best revenue stream for nvidia, from a new product perspective. The console's hardware specs could be updated every 12-18 months (a la iPad) taking advantage of better & more cost effective hardware while maintaining backwards compatibility thanks to the very nature of PC gaming. Developers would be able to target set specs for future steam consoles, while still providing graphical presets for current or & older boxes to maintain smooth frame rates. Developers will build for / port to Linux if there is a viable platform, and Valve has the muscle to deliver that. I realize that it would turn off / not appeal to many PC enthusiasts, but it would appeal to the much larger crowd that wants in on the bells and whistles of PC gaming (mods via steam workshop, higher graphics, cloud saves, cheaper game prices, mouse & keyboard) without the fear or headache of hardware and driver issues.
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Old 01-07-2013, 01:40 PM   #77
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Actually NVDA is looking into cloud gaming services more than anything else. They didn't win any next-gen console contracts AFAIK, perhaps because they see the future of gaming in the Cloud and consoles giving way to HTPCs/Steamboxes/etc. OnLive failed, but I think it was ahead of its time. Broadband needs to get lower-latency for it to work properly, for one thing. Perhaps in countries like South Korea...

http://www.ubergizmo.com/2012/05/gai...aming-service/

The US is still a decade away from popular cloud-based gaming imho, but whatever experience NVDA gains overseas or whatever, can be brought here if/when US broadband gets better.


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Spoken like a true shareholder! Hahaha seriously though, I don't see it selling through the roof, but like I said earlier in the thread, I can see gamer parents getting this for their kid so the kid isn't always using daddy's phone but can play all the cheap/free games he likes on dad's phone. Then when little johnny is sleeping, dad has s new gadget to play with.


If the often rumored steam console comes out, I see that as being the potentially best revenue stream for nvidia, from a new product perspective. The console's hardware specs could be updated every 12-18 months (a la iPad) taking advantage of better & more cost effective hardware while maintaining backwards compatibility thanks to the very nature of PC gaming. Developers would be able to target set specs for future steam consoles, while still providing graphical presets for current or & older boxes to maintain smooth frame rates. Developers will build for / port to Linux if there is a viable platform, and Valve has the muscle to deliver that. I realize that it would turn off / not appeal to many PC enthusiasts, but it would appeal to the much larger crowd that wants in on the bells and whistles of PC gaming (mods via steam workshop, higher graphics, cloud saves, cheaper game prices, mouse & keyboard) without the fear or headache of hardware and driver issues.
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Old 01-07-2013, 01:41 PM   #78
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Spoken like a true shareholder! Hahaha seriously though, I don't see it selling through the roof, but like I said earlier in the thread, I can see gamer parents getting this for their kid so the kid isn't always using daddy's phone but can play all the cheap/free games he likes on dad's phone. Then when little johnny is sleeping, dad has s new gadget to play with.
This is really going to come down to price because there are plenty of other Android devices out there that can be used to play games.

I slept on it and I am still not liking "Project Shield," we'll just have to wait and see how it goes.
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Old 01-07-2013, 01:49 PM   #79
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STEAM has that Big Picture thing that lets you use a controller on your TV easier. If I was going to screw around with TVs and controllers, I think STEAM has me covered.
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Old 01-07-2013, 01:51 PM   #80
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Okay, after thinking about it while "working" I've come to the conclusion for $100, I'd buy it. Anything more and it's entering "is it worth it?" territory. I love gaming on the go. My MOGA + Note 2 + Emulators have reminded me how fun console games *could* be.

So I won't rule it out yet. Nvidia gives me a good price and I'd go for something like this with a more *open platform versus a Nintendo/Sony product.

*By open I mean rootable without voiding any services ala PSN on PSP/Vita.
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Old 01-07-2013, 01:55 PM   #81
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Actually NVDA is looking into cloud gaming services more than anything else. They didn't win any next-gen console contracts AFAIK, perhaps because they see the future of gaming in the Cloud and consoles giving way to HTPCs/Steamboxes/etc. OnLive failed, but I think it was ahead of its time. Broadband needs to get lower-latency for it to work properly, for one thing. Perhaps in countries like South Korea...

http://www.ubergizmo.com/2012/05/gai...aming-service/

The US is still a decade away from popular cloud-based gaming imho, but whatever experience NVDA gains overseas or whatever, can be brought here if/when US broadband gets better.
Maybe once Google Fiber hits most of the populated areas, but that's years down the road.

I still think localization of data is the best way. You get to choose how much resources you want and energy use from data transfer is way down.

Unless they have an energy plan for handling the huge bandwidth requirements and massive supercomputer requirements of a cloud based gaming service.

I just don't like the idea of it. Sharing resources between people is great for cost reduction in, say, a single company's office, but this won't reduce cost...

Google Fiber could barely handle raw 1080p output @60fps.
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Old 01-07-2013, 01:55 PM   #82
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Is the project shield thing always going to be a dedicated device or is it more a suite of software services? (sorry too busy to look into it myself. )


If its a dedicated device its going to die on its arse.
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Old 01-07-2013, 02:01 PM   #83
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I changed my mind. I'd buy it. Don't ask me why. Maybe this video has something to do with it. It just looks cool and its made by Nvidia. I trust Nvidia for all my gaming needs and they know what I need and want better than I do.
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Old 01-07-2013, 02:02 PM   #84
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$100 dollars ? LOL, it will come it at best around the Sony Vita. $250.00 . A xbox controller is 45.00 not on sale at Best Buy. You are not going to get a device with a advanced screen and higher end wi-fi for 100.00 bucks. Well maybe if they end up like the HP tablets , when HP, pulled them from the market. And suddenly everyone wanted one, because of the new perceived value.
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Old 01-07-2013, 02:11 PM   #85
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$100 dollars ? LOL, it will come it at best around the Sony Vita. $250.00 . A xbox controller is 45.00 not on sale at Best Buy. You are not going to get a device with a advanced screen and higher end wi-fi for 100.00 bucks. Well maybe if they end up like the HP tablets , when HP, pulled them from the market. And suddenly everyone wanted one, because of the new perceived value.
If it comes down to it what seems more reasonable to buy? A game console with multiple first/third party developers backing it or a console that plays iPhone games on the go and can play PC games only when your in range of your PC?

It has to be cheaper than $250 to even compete.
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Old 01-07-2013, 02:20 PM   #86
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Cheap hardware only comes when there are alternate income possibilities, like a smart phone plan or the inevitable Amazon, book and audio/video purchases, Itunes. Without that, hardware is going to priced nearer to cost. There is no escaping that.
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Old 01-07-2013, 03:52 PM   #87
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All those nexus 7 games are touch screen -
Spoken like someone who doesn't actually own a Nexus 7

Monster Madness, Vendetta Online, Riptide GP, GTA3, GTAVC, Sonic 4, Max Payne and Dead Trigger off the top of my head for N7 games I have that support a controller- that is ignoring the emulators.

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Then buy a controller - much cheaper and lighter then the shield.
Steam Big Picture mode doesn't work all that great on my phone or tablets. This does.

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Remember you already have to have some box plugged into your tv for it to work
Nope, if your TV supports Miracast you don't, you can also just plug the controller into the TV directly.

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Browser is the default browser that's installed on Samsung phones and used to be installed on everything else.
The default browser on post 4.0 Android devices is Chrome powered by default. Given we are talking about a Nexus device, that is included.

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Even non-demanding games seem to have "hitching" or framerate problems that make me wonder how this can be considered powerful or a better gaming machine than the Vita.
I don't think I've seen anyone say the N7 is more powerful then the Vita. The Vita has a monsterous SoC and has hand optimized code that goes far beyond what we see for any Android games. BTW- I'd say check out Horn to see something that is at least reasonably optimized for the N7. It may not be giving the best Vita games a run for its' money, but I find it to be reasonably impressive.

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All of these solutions provide you with the same thing, and open gaming platform that is portable.
I don't see full Steam support on any of those devices besides Shield. That is kind of big deal. As in, the major selling point.

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Woah what version MOGA is that?
Their new one, just got announced a couple of days ago.

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Okay, after thinking about it while "working" I've come to the conclusion for $100, I'd buy it.
I'm expecting it to be closer to $300 honestly. The thing has *far* too much hardware to get close to $100.
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Old 01-07-2013, 04:25 PM   #88
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The default browser on post 4.0 Android devices is Chrome powered by default. Given we are talking about a Nexus device, that is included.
The default browser on my SGS3 running 4.1.2 is most definitely not chrome. How similar under the hood it is is a different matter but it performs differently and has different features to the chrome browser from the market.

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I don't see full Steam support on any of those devices besides Shield. That is kind of big deal. As in, the major selling point.
Does it have steam support or is it more like a remote desktop?
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Old 01-07-2013, 05:20 PM   #89
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The default browser on my SGS3
On Nexus devices, it's Chrome.

http://samsung-updates.com/wp-conten...ct-Image-3.jpg

See the browser icon on the Nexus 10? That is Chrome.

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Does it have steam support or is it more like a remote desktop?
Closer to a remote desktop I guess you would say. It is different then SplashTop or anything like that, uses dedicated hardware on nV GPUs to encode and stream to Shield, Steam Big Screen mode works out of the box.
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Old 01-07-2013, 05:29 PM   #90
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Wireless connectivity on the Shield is courtesy Broadcom's latest BCM43241 which is 2x2:2 802.11a/b/g/n, which is the right thing to do in a platform that so strongly leverages wireless display and control. Responsivity while playing PC games on the Shield was extremely good, I couldn't detect any lag.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/6564/h...roject-shield-
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Old 01-07-2013, 05:51 PM   #91
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On Nexus devices, it's Chrome.

http://samsung-updates.com/wp-conten...ct-Image-3.jpg

See the browser icon on the Nexus 10? That is Chrome.
Yeah I know, that's what I said. Nexus was using Chrome (the slower browser) unnamed nvidia tablet was using 'browser' the faster browser.



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Closer to a remote desktop I guess you would say. It is different then SplashTop or anything like that, uses dedicated hardware on nV GPUs to encode and stream to Shield, Steam Big Screen mode works out of the box.
Yes but it's probably completely transparent to steam. That's not really having steam support.
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Old 01-07-2013, 05:58 PM   #92
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The hardware encoding block on the NVidia cards is an interesting little bit of kit. From what I gather it was originally added to make their cloud gaming solutions happen, but this is a cool side bonus of it. Shame it's not something more portable though.
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Old 01-07-2013, 06:02 PM   #93
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If this were priced appropriately (cheaply), it could be enough to convince me to go back to Nvidia. While I'm in the APU camp, and planning on the equivalent of the A10-5800 for my next rig... a cheap handheld streaming device like this for the right price could convince me to buy another discrete card.
I know I faced a lot of goons, punk kids and shills when I've said this before but: Physx & cross-eyed gaming aka tHrEE DeE circle jerking is retarded and the technologies suck or are pointless (take your pick).

This though, I approve of. Kudos to Nvidia for doing something meaningful alongside their attempt at vendor lock-in.

My questions (in order of importance): 1. Price, 2. does it work with every game that supports a gamepad, and 3. can you still use the computer while streaming in the background.
I kind of doubt the high standards evidenced by those questions can be met satisfactorily, so I'm suspecting I'm going with an A10-5800 rig in Xfire with my old 5870 until it dies. But my mind and wallet could be open to this.

Concerns are how fun the 5" screen is to use, and how most PC games translate to it. I'm probably going to have to pass on this idea, but it's nice to see NV trying to innovate (even if it unfortunately includes another lockin attempt). To be fair though, it's not probably going to be enough fun to make it work on Radeons as well. This isn't as big of a deal as Eyefinity. It's not likely this is going to spread like wildfire and everyone's going to have to have one.

And if it does, we'll see a vendor agnostic version come out eventually and this will be a short-lived exclusive.
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Old 01-07-2013, 06:06 PM   #94
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If this were priced appropriately (cheaply), it could be enough to convince me to go back to Nvidia. While I'm in the APU camp, and planning on the equivalent of the A10-5800 for my next rig... a cheap handheld streaming device like this for the right price could convince me to buy another discrete card.
I know I faced a lot of goons, punk kids and shills when I've said this before but: Physx & cross-eyed gaming aka tHrEE DeE circle jerking is retarded and the technologies suck or are pointless (take your pick).

This though, I approve of. Kudos to Nvidia for doing something meaningful alongside their attempt at vendor lock-in.

My questions (in order of importance): 1. Price, 2. does it work with every game that supports a gamepad, and 3. can you still use the computer while streaming in the background.
I kind of doubt the high standards evidenced by those questions can be met satisfactorily, so I'm suspecting I'm going with an A10-5800 rig in Xfire with my old 5870 until it dies. But my mind and wallet could be open to this.
I'm pretty sure that won't work. You can only pair the APU's with a limited number of discrete cards.
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Old 01-07-2013, 06:17 PM   #95
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Looks like it wouldn't work as you said. I'd just use the discrete card until it dies then, at which point I'd move to the APU.
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Old 01-07-2013, 06:24 PM   #96
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Nexus was using Chrome (the slower browser) unnamed nvidia tablet was using 'browser' the faster browser.
I understand now, you have benches with comparative performance you can offer, very nice, please link them up. I thought you were just using the obscenely absurd line that because a singular phone has an optimized proprietary browser that must be the same across all devices.

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Yes but it's probably completely transparent to steam. That's not really having steam support.
Semantics much? If fully supports Steam. That better?

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If this were priced appropriately (cheaply)
I would be shocked if it is under $300. That is a *lot* of hardware.

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Physx & cross-eyed gaming aka tHrEE DeE circle jerking is retarded and the technologies suck or are pointless (take your pick).
Why not get a Pong box and be done with it? Hating on physics getting better in games is just, well, retarded

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This isn't as big of a deal as Eyefinity.
If it is equal to Eyefinity then it will be nVidia's largest failure since the NV1. Given how utterly worthless Eyefinity has been in the consumer market I don't think that would even be remotely in the league of what NV would consider success. As a portable gaming platform, if you don't hit 100 million units you are considered a failure(see PSP which didn't quite hit nine figures). I think nV would take half of that and be pleased, but tens of thousands? That would be an epic fail.

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And if it does, we'll see a vendor agnostic version come out eventually and this will be a short-lived exclusive.
Pretty safe bet that if it is a major marketplace failure, AMD will be at the forefront supporting it. If it is something that is going to make money hand over fist that AMD will stay as far away from it as possible.
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Old 01-07-2013, 11:30 PM   #97
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The above reads a little.. well, biased. But disregarding that, I would have to note on the twist of words, that no ones against PHYSICS getting better in games, more against Physx. To be fully honest about it, only a retard or a shill goes balls out in defense of vendor lock-in.

I don't think most of us here (excluding yourself, from the way that reads) give a crap about Nvidia or AMD's fortunes other than some weak appeal for lower prices on everything.
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Old 01-08-2013, 01:05 AM   #98
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Spoken like a true shareholder! Hahaha seriously though, I don't see it selling through the roof, but like I said earlier in the thread, I can see gamer parents getting this for their kid so the kid isn't always using daddy's phone but can play all the cheap/free games he likes on dad's phone. Then when little johnny is sleeping, dad has s new gadget to play with.


If the often rumored steam console comes out, I see that as being the potentially best revenue stream for nvidia, from a new product perspective. The console's hardware specs could be updated every 12-18 months (a la iPad) taking advantage of better & more cost effective hardware while maintaining backwards compatibility thanks to the very nature of PC gaming. Developers would be able to target set specs for future steam consoles, while still providing graphical presets for current or & older boxes to maintain smooth frame rates. Developers will build for / port to Linux if there is a viable platform, and Valve has the muscle to deliver that. I realize that it would turn off / not appeal to many PC enthusiasts, but it would appeal to the much larger crowd that wants in on the bells and whistles of PC gaming (mods via steam workshop, higher graphics, cloud saves, cheaper game prices, mouse & keyboard) without the fear or headache of hardware and driver issues.
The parents getting it for kids thing doesn't really seem like it will happen either because kids are getting their own smartphones far earlier in life that us 25+ year olds did. Back in my day...... lol

My wife teaches 2nd grade and there are kids that have their own iphones in her class. It's absurd.
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Old 01-08-2013, 02:31 AM   #99
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I understand now, you have benches with comparative performance you can offer, very nice, please link them up. I thought you were just using the obscenely absurd line that because a singular phone has an optimized proprietary browser that must be the same across all devices.
Sorry I thought we were trying to compare the speed at which a device loads Web pages. While to me it makes sense to use the same browser on both devices you carry on talking about...whatever it is you're talking about.



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Semantics much? If fully supports Steam. That better?
Better but still weird. It's like saying your monitor fully supports steam.
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Old 01-08-2013, 03:55 AM   #100
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Spoken like someone who doesn't actually own a Nexus 7

Monster Madness, Vendetta Online, Riptide GP, GTA3, GTAVC, Sonic 4, Max Payne and Dead Trigger off the top of my head for N7 games I have that support a controller- that is ignoring the emulators.
Have nexus 7, kids game on it all the time, have about 50 or 60 they play regularly - they are all designed to be used with a tablet touch screen - not surprising really as that's what they are played on (tablets and phones). Of those above have riptide gp, and that's basically a motion game - you control it by angling the tablet and click the right place on the screen to boost. That's the best way to play it, not with a controller. My point stands - sure there will be a few nvidia optimised games but basically nearly all of the thousands of games will be designed for a tablet not a controller.
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