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Old 12-26-2012, 12:11 PM   #126
Coup27
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Whilst I agree with what you have said in principle, I really doubt Amazon's recommendation system is sophisticated enough to change recommendations after firmwares have been released to fix previous firmware bugs. Otherwise if it does and it keeps the previous customer ratings which were scored on buggy firmware, the whole thing gets skewed.
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Old 12-26-2012, 12:16 PM   #127
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Whilst I agree with what you have said in principle, I really doubt Amazon's recommendation system is sophisticated enough to change recommendations after firmwares have been released to fix previous firmware bugs. Otherwise if it does and it keeps the previous customer ratings which were scored on buggy firmware, the whole thing gets skewed.
What I was trying to get it is we don't know what their rating interval is. My guess is it isn't the entire life of the product. Maybe it's the last 3 months? Don't know and never will.
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Old 12-26-2012, 05:14 PM   #128
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That doesn't even make sense.
You think arguing a 4.7 rating on Amazon.com versus another product with a 4.6 rating on Amazon makes more sense??

It's semantics.

It means nothing.
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Old 12-26-2012, 05:34 PM   #129
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You think arguing a 4.7 rating on Amazon.com versus another product with a 4.6 rating on Amazon makes more sense??

It's semantics.

It means nothing.
The point being how can Amazon recommend a product with a lower score than an alternative when they have both been scored with their own points system. Whether the margin was 0.1 or 5 it doesn't matter. What is the points system there for if it isn't to be used as system to recommend products.

Trying to defeat this argument by suggesting it's semantics because it's only a difference of 0.1 is a straw man.
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Old 12-26-2012, 10:49 PM   #130
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Read articles on paid shills, they are all over the net now. Amazon and other sites are packed with shill reviewers. A high score doesn't mean anything. A low score on Amazon with many reviews (over 40) all saying it sucks, probably means it's bad.

Lastly, the average rating of products a amazon is above 3.5 stars IIRC... close to 4. So 5 = possibly good 4 = possibly good, but look into this carefully 3 stars or worse = probably avoid
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Old 12-27-2012, 08:46 AM   #131
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Read articles on paid shills, they are all over the net now. Amazon and other sites are packed with shill reviewers. A high score doesn't mean anything. A low score on Amazon with many reviews (over 40) all saying it sucks, probably means it's bad.

Lastly, the average rating of products a amazon is above 3.5 stars IIRC... close to 4. So 5 = possibly good 4 = possibly good, but look into this carefully 3 stars or worse = probably avoid
none of that matters to the argument of amazon's own recommendation being skewed somehow. As it recommends a product with a lower score over a product with a higher one. Meaning that score is not the only criteria. So the cynic has to ask, what is the other criteria?
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Old 12-27-2012, 09:25 AM   #132
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none of that matters to the argument of amazon's own recommendation being skewed somehow. As it recommends a product with a lower score over a product with a higher one. Meaning that score is not the only criteria. So the cynic has to ask, what is the other criteria?
There has to be some time component to it. The Vertex 4 has had almost flawless reviews the past month and the quantity of reviews has been far greater than others (M4, Samsung 830, Samsung 840 etc.)

I wonder if they're doing the same "burn in" testing with the Vertex 4 that they're doing with the Vector.
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Old 12-27-2012, 09:45 AM   #133
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The point being how can Amazon recommend a product with a lower score than an alternative when they have both been scored with their own points system. Whether the margin was 0.1 or 5 it doesn't matter. What is the points system there for if it isn't to be used as system to recommend products.

Trying to defeat this argument by suggesting it's semantics because it's only a difference of 0.1 is a straw man.
You again missing the point.

It's nonsense.

It means nothing.

It's useless.

It's not worth your effort and words to discuss a 4.6 versus a 4.7 amazon rating.

Regardless if the rating system is perfect or seriously flawed. It does not matter.

Why da fuq r we bothering to bicker of such nonsense???

Here's the bottom line: Vertex4 is a good drive. It's been out long enough and sold well enough to provide a reasonable basis to judge it as a viable and reliable option.

Beyond that its senseless to talk more and bicker over validity of amazon rating system.

Unless Someone has some significant data showing the vertex4 is much worse I just don't see the point at all in continued discussion over trivial and insignificant details.
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Old 12-27-2012, 10:20 AM   #134
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You again missing the point.
Other way around

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It's not worth your effort and words to discuss a 4.6 versus a 4.7 amazon rating.

Regardless if the rating system is perfect or seriously flawed. It does not matter.
Nobody is arguing nor cares if the system is perfect or flawed. The question is HOW the system actually works. the question he is asking is WHY does amazon rating system contradict itself.

your counter argument of "well its only 0.1 points" is totally irrelevent to the fact that the contradiction exists. The strawmen you present of "perfect system or seriously flawed" is again irrelevent to the question of the contradiction. Your rant about the vertex 4 being a good drive is again irrelevant to that question.

The man asked a simple question, "why is there a contradiction in the system". All you have done is attack him for daring to ask that question and go on and on about completely unrelated rants which you for some reason are addressing at him as if he asked, disagrees with you, or is trying to discuss that issue.

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There has to be some time component to it. The Vertex 4 has had almost flawless reviews the past month and the quantity of reviews has been far greater than others (M4, Samsung 830, Samsung 840 etc.)
That is plausible. It makes sense to give additional weight to newer electronics as old one go obsolete.
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Old 12-27-2012, 10:23 AM   #135
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Originally Posted by Mfusick View Post
You again missing the point.
It's nonsense.
It means nothing.
It's useless.

It's not worth your effort and words to discuss a 4.6 versus a 4.7 amazon rating.

Regardless if the rating system is perfect or seriously flawed. It does not matter.
If that is how you feel then why were you so concerned earlier when somebody questioned the logic of the system:

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You only question the value of that list because it does not represent what you want to see.

If the list said OCZ was the worst you would be standing on your soap box screaming about it's validity.
3 people now in this thread including myself have shown how the Amazon system is flawed. For some reason you have really struggled to comprehend this point and have now thrown your toys out of the pram saying it doesn't matter anyway. Well it did earlier when it was trumpeting the Vertex 4. I think you have just made yourself look very silly indeed.
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Old 12-27-2012, 06:01 PM   #136
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Guys... I am saying newgg /amazon or whoever reviews are trash.

They don't matter. I'm trying to tell you it does not matter because the reviews mean nothing and have no relevance.

In years reading stupid reviews the only reliable trend I notice is that lower end products and nooby products tend to get worse reviews because the buyers are idiots and set them up wrong- or have some type of user error causing the negative review.

Higher end products and enthusiast products get better reviews because of who buys them and how they are set up properly.

I'll stick with a professional review. Those reviews are meaningless to me. I don't see the point in debating if the system is flawed or not.
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Old 12-27-2012, 07:24 PM   #137
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In years reading stupid reviews the only reliable trend I notice is that lower end products and nooby products tend to get worse reviews because the buyers are idiots and set them up wrong- or have some type of user error causing the negative review.

Higher end products and enthusiast products get better reviews because of who buys them and how they are set up properly.
I'm glad you made this point. I was going to say something similar before but decided against it because I anticipate I'll be asked for data to back it up.
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Old 12-27-2012, 07:35 PM   #138
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Looks awfully like you two have decided to spin your argument into something totally different now you have realised it's going nowhere.

I'm done with this thread.
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Old 12-27-2012, 07:39 PM   #139
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Looks awfully like you two have decided to spin your argument into something totally different now you have realised it's going nowhere.

I'm done with this thread.
I'd like to talk about Sandforce's next controller. 9 months ago it had an ETA of Q2 2013.
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Old 12-27-2012, 08:28 PM   #140
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God I created a can of worms when I started this thread!
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Old 12-28-2012, 03:11 AM   #141
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I'd like to talk about Sandforce's next controller. 9 months ago it had an ETA of Q2 2013.
I'm betting we'll see something during CES.
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Old 12-28-2012, 11:32 AM   #142
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I'm betting we'll see something during CES.
I think you're right. Personally, I'd like to see a firmware smart enough to choose between compression or not.. based on the workload, fresh block availability, and potential compressibility of the data used. Unlikely as that would surely make for pretty complex code and potentially too much performance variation.. but that would surely be a nice hybrid arrangement and keep both sides of the camp happy.

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God I created a can of worms when I started this thread!
no you didn't. You just opened the lid of the one that constantly sits on the shelf around here and unknowingly sprinkled a pinch of salt to wake "them little guys" up.
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