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Old 12-04-2012, 09:21 AM   #1
moonbogg
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Default Returning laptop cuz of Windows 8

Bought my wife a laptop last night (just a quick and cheap one) and I saw it had windows 8 on it. I figured "oh nice, the new windows" so I picked it up. Turns out its trying to act like a giant tablet and this POS is going straight back to the store. Windows 8 is murder. Hate it and I have no interest in giving it "an honest chance" because my wife needs to do work on this thing, not dick around with it for weeks just to learn how to use it. Its a stupid giant tablet OS that should be dead and burried.
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Old 12-04-2012, 09:27 AM   #2
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That's silly imo. If the computer was a good deal, keep it. There's nothing difficult about Win8. It has some irritating points, but once you learn less than a handful of tricks, it's the same as all the other Windows. If someone couldn't learn Win8 in a half hour, I'd question their general ability to use a computer.
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Old 12-04-2012, 09:33 AM   #3
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I agree with lxskllr...Windows 8 is windows 7 with a different start menu interface....other than that it's practically the same(at least in the way I use it)
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Old 12-04-2012, 10:39 AM   #4
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I'm guessing moonbogg and his wife didn't get to the desktop UI and only saw/tried metro
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Old 12-04-2012, 10:41 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by Kristijonas View Post
I'm guessing moonbogg and his wife didn't get to the desktop UI and only saw/tried metro
Yep. I might try to install one of those programs that give you windows back instead of this tablet garbage. I couldn't get past the vomiting to even try to look for a different UI. This is my first impression of the new OS, like it or not. That impression can be described as intense rage and hatred. Maybe I can get an IT degree to learn how to navigate through the garbage?
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Old 12-04-2012, 11:05 AM   #6
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I'm at a loss of words
I can't even find a good enough comparison of how unsmart this is. Seriously, moonbogg, you made me lose even more faith in humanity. Clicking on a button that has "desktop" written on it must be too hard for some.
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Old 12-04-2012, 11:23 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kristijonas View Post
I'm at a loss of words
I can't even find a good enough comparison of how unsmart this is. Seriously, moonbogg, you made me lose even more faith in humanity. Clicking on a button that has "desktop" written on it must be too hard for some.
Hehe...
I have heard it all now from "simple childish interface "to "need an IT degree to learn it",basically Win8 is very easy to use if you can be bothered to sit down and learn how to use it like any OS,its not that far different from Win7 and Metro can be avoided for the most part,I understand everybody has different opinions on Win8 etc...however I would not say its hard to learn,you almost make me wish I was back in my DOS 6.22 days, now that was an OS where you needed to learn a thing or two.
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Old 12-04-2012, 12:11 PM   #8
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Alright alright, so i'm being a little simplistic and bashing it because I don't want to learn how to use a new OS. I want it to be simple and familiar, and it is at least not familiar. I'll give it an actual try and see how it goes.
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Old 12-04-2012, 12:52 PM   #9
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Yes, i'd say it's simple, but not familiar (as in, different than W7).
Things to know:
When you boot your PC, wait for the metro interface to load, there should be many adjustable buttons there. One of them has "desktop" written on it. Well, when clicking on it, it opens up W8 desktop mode, which is exactly the same as in W7 minus the start menu. Instead of the start menu, in desktop mode, you can move your mouse button to the bottom left screen and a small icon will appear. Click the right mouse button on that icon for a list of system options. When you want to use search, simply click the "windows" keyboard button and type. When you want to shutdown/sleep, go to the desktop and press alt+f4. To quickly enter "my computer", press windows keyboard button + E. These are the basics, I think.
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Old 12-04-2012, 12:57 PM   #10
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Buy Start8 and stop whining about it.
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Old 12-04-2012, 01:40 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moonbogg View Post
Yep. I might try to install one of those programs that give you windows back instead of this tablet garbage. I couldn't get past the vomiting to even try to look for a different UI. This is my first impression of the new OS, like it or not. That impression can be described as intense rage and hatred. Maybe I can get an IT degree to learn how to navigate through the garbage?
There's no getting Windows back because it's still there and if you don't use any Metro apps you'll barely see the Metro interface. Your intense fear of change and ignorance of how to use the relatively minor differences doesn't make the system a bad one.
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Old 12-04-2012, 02:58 PM   #12
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Buy Start8 and stop whining about it.
Yeah, $5 is cheaper than the cost of time / gas to return the thing if a Windows 7 like experience is wanted.
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Old 12-04-2012, 05:47 PM   #13
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I personally am getting used to and beginning to like Windows 8.
Then again, I have used keyboard shortcuts forever, so Alt-Tab, Alt-F4 for tasks
doesn't matter to me in tiles or desktop. The OS itself runs really smooth and I
am sure some of the under the hood updates over Win 7 are worth it in spades.
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Old 12-04-2012, 06:36 PM   #14
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Install Windows 7 on it.

I've never seen such butt-hurt whining as from the pro-Win8 crowd every time people express their dislike of it. Not everyone wants a layer of crap over their desktop that just gets in the way/has to be ignored/worked around. If the best advice people can offer is "buy this third party app just to get back to the function you want" or "just get used to it!" or the ultimate butt-hurt stupidity "your're just afraid of change wahhh!" you know they aren't really thinking critically and are just making excuses for whatever reason. (Fanboism, Microsoft shilling, afraid of admitting the OS they've hitched onto isn't all that to everyone else, whatever the motive...)

If your wife wants a computer to do work with and doesn't want to jump through a bunch of hoops just to get back to an interface that doesn't annoy her and get in the way of her work, it isn't "fear of change" it's simply a logical preference.

Fanboism is the death of technology, because it settles for hype and bullshit rather than truly examining and dealing with things critically, and therefore fixing and improving flaws.

If everyone just bends over, grabs their ankles and excepts every stupid thing any big company's marketing hype dept. comes out with at face value, and is too afraid of saying "Hey wait a minute. Some things about this are freakin' stupid. I don't want change for the sake of change, I want change that builds on what WORKS in an intelligent way" then all we can expect is half-baked crap, rather than truly well executed tech innovations.

Windows 8/Metro and its whole schizophrenic tablet/desktop hodgepodge has some serious flaws that fly in the face of more logical UI design and ARE going to annoy the hell out of many productive people. Don't let a bunch of butt-hurt whining keep you from being critical of it if it's not for you.

What do people really think is better in the long run? Mircrosoft coming out with a half-baked idea (which they've done MANY times) and hearing nothing but a bunch of brown nosing praise? Or hearing from the people that actually look at things critically and say to them "This, this and this, are horribly executed. This, this and this are good ideas but need work.This, this and this are great, well done." Without the chorus of people telling them exactly what they thought of turkeys like ME and Vista and not just screaming "Just get used to it!! Everyone who doesn't fall to their knees worshiping it hates change! wahh!" we wouldn't have gotten the improved follow ups.
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Old 12-04-2012, 07:27 PM   #15
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Great reply, Zaap.

The sheer number of workarounds and ergonomic disasters is making Win 8 impossible to use as efficiently as any OS since XP.
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Old 12-04-2012, 08:50 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kristijonas View Post
Yes, i'd say it's simple, but not familiar (as in, different than W7).
Things to know:
When you boot your PC, wait for the metro interface to load, there should be many adjustable buttons there. One of them has "desktop" written on it. Well, when clicking on it, it opens up W8 desktop mode, which is exactly the same as in W7 minus the start menu. Instead of the start menu, in desktop mode, you can move your mouse button to the bottom left screen and a small icon will appear. Click the right mouse button on that icon for a list of system options. When you want to use search, simply click the "windows" keyboard button and type. When you want to shutdown/sleep, go to the desktop and press alt+f4. To quickly enter "my computer", press windows keyboard button + E. These are the basics, I think.
Sorry but there is nothing intuitive about clicking on an icon that says "desktop" as a way to switch to a completely different UI.

There's no reason anyone would think they needed two UIs in the first place.

All ofyou W8 fans could be a lot more helpful if you weren't so dismissive of the people who are confronted with so unintuitive as a non-touch computer defaulting to a touch-centric operating system.
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Old 12-04-2012, 09:03 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom View Post
All ofyou W8 fans could be a lot more helpful if you weren't so dismissive of the people who are confronted with so unintuitive as a non-touch computer defaulting to a touch-centric operating system.
I'm not a fan of Win8. I don't even use Windows. Win8 isn't the end of the world, or even desktop computing. I can get around in it fine, and I haven't run Windows in 3 years. It certainly isn't worth returning a computer due to the interface.
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Old 12-04-2012, 10:21 PM   #18
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Great reply, Zaap.

The sheer number of workarounds and ergonomic disasters is making Win 8 impossible to use as efficiently as any OS since XP.
Indeed, plus its likely MS will break compatibility with these workarounds making what is already a colossal mess even more so.
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Old 12-05-2012, 07:09 AM   #19
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Sorry but there is nothing intuitive about clicking on an icon that says "desktop" as a way to switch to a completely different UI.

There's no reason anyone would think they needed two UIs in the first place.

All of you W8 fans could be a lot more helpful if you weren't so dismissive of the people who are confronted with so unintuitive as a non-touch computer defaulting to a touch-centric operating system.
Look at his first post he gives no constructive reasons why ,it seems most of the anti-Win8 campaigners for 98% of the time are just moaning for the sake of it with no constructive feedback and refuse to even try to get use to Win8,let me say I'm not a Windows fan as such,my first PC OS was DOS 6.22 and I will always be a DOS fan and have fond memories of it decades ago,I got use to Windows and the changes after every new Windows release for better or worst,one thing I do know you get some anti-8 campaigners that give honest constructive feedback,then you get others that just troll and give no reasons,I've seen this since Win95 and onwards


You can bet it will not stop at Win8,ie Win9,10 etc.. will get some troll posts and non constructive feedback.
Its one thing to dislike an OS and give constructive feedback rather then stupid no constructive statements.
For the record I only use Windows because of gaming,I still use Linux (great non gaming alternative).

Win8 is not hard to adapt or adjust too,I went into Win8 open minded and took the time to learn it properly for all its strengths and weaknesses.
I don't miss the start button,you really don't need it(I thought it was needed in Win8 beta,but I was wrong after I took the time to use official Win8 without a start menu button).


I understand some people don't like Win8,no OS is perfect but try to give some honest constructive feedback for reasons why after you have taken the time to learn the OS,just remember it works both ways there are plenty of people that do like Win8 as well,we all have different opinions but try to be constructive either way.

For the record the only two Windows operating systems that I did not like was Win3.1 and ME,I won't bore you with the reasons why.

I'll try and answer Tom's first question about UI,it seems to me that Win8 being a hybrid OS this is the way Microsoft wanted to make it ie Desktop and Metro sides which cover most things on most hardware,personally I find it quite natural now(yes I know some will say shock horror) but its only one or two clicks max for me to find or launch anything, now is that hard for me?...hell no,its fast and very stable and I can run all my software/games just fine,easy for me to navigate around as a desktop user,even had a play with Metro side ie making my own columns for games,my software etc....remember I'm a desktop/gamer user with no touchscreen and been using Microsoft since DOS 6.22 days(my favorite OS).


Do note I spend the most time on desktop as well(mainly because I'm a desktop user) but don't mind going to Metro if I need too.
I can use Win8 desktop for about 98- 99% as a desktop OS.

I still think Win9 will still be a hybrid OS with more refinement on Metro side.
I also think Microsoft will be dropping a pure desktop OS for good like XP,Vista,Win7 for a current hybrid OS like Win8 in their future operating systems.

Regardless of the anti-8 and Pro Win8 people here,I'll say I think we will be in for some interesting times when Win9 is released,which way will Microsoft go with regards to layout/UI etc...interesting times ahead and I look forward to Win9,10 like I always do with any new OS.


There you have it my honest feedback.
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Old 12-05-2012, 08:10 AM   #20
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Sorry but there is nothing intuitive about clicking on an icon that says "desktop" as a way to switch to a completely different UI.

There's no reason anyone would think they needed two UIs in the first place.

All ofyou W8 fans could be a lot more helpful if you weren't so dismissive of the people who are confronted with so unintuitive as a non-touch computer defaulting to a touch-centric operating system.
Windows has never been intuitive, it's a learned system and with changes comes new things to learn.
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Old 12-05-2012, 09:44 AM   #21
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Zaap,

I am proW8, but I don't agree with your blame of shilling or fanboism. I simply honestly believe W8 is better than W7 after doing a thorough research and experiencing both.

"Fanboism is the death of technology, because it settles for hype and bullshit rather than truly examining and dealing with things critically, and therefore fixing and improving flaws."

How is overlooking all the benefits of a new OS and rejecting it only because it's UI is DIFFERENT benefiting technological innovation? It's blind rejection. It's almost like rejecting Apple OSs because they don't look like W7. It's a different OS, it has a different approach. At least in UI area.


Learning to use W8 is quicker than purchasing and installing W7 or RMAing the laptop and buying a new one. Give it a chance. To be honest, you don't need 10 minutes to master the W8 UI. W8 UI is NOT more difficult to learn than that of W7. It's just that W7 had a familiar UI that began with W95. W8 doesn't completely follow the same UI path and that's it.
Whether W7 or W8 UI is better, it cannot be proven. W7 was around for too long to be objectively viewed. Most users view W7 UI as if it's universal Windows UI and it's as it should be. However W8 came with new (better or worse) UI ideas. All we can agree with is that W7 and W8 do things differently. I don't believe anyone could objectively say that W8 does things worse. Personally, I believe both W7 and W8 allow the same level of productivity. But I prefer W8 because it's snappier and I like using search in Metro just by clicking windows button.

Then, when we put UI learning aside, we see that W7 does nothing better than W8. W8 is better in anything else. It's a new OS and it's still so very compatible with almost all hardware and software. I think it's better at that than W7 was at the start.

So basically I think W8 is an improved W7 with a slightly changed UI.

I really feel sorry for people who are blindly rejecting W8. Not because of W8 but because of their mindset which is rejecting things regardless of what they are, but just because they are not familiar and "just seem wrongly done". I only seriously view criticism from people who say that they used W7 and learned to fully use W8 and don't like it. I can respect that. Also I agree that W8 should have given a choice of UI for the user. That couldn't be hard to implement. One click and your Start Menu is back. But then perhaps we'd be still using DOS OS if we'd always allow choosing the old? Bashing a NEW OS just for it being different is like racism. It's like saying "I've seen white people only on TV and they all look suspicious to me. I don't believe they behave like normal human beings and I wouldn't like to meet one!" Just relax and talk to one of them when you get a chance to meet them. You will understand that it's just the color of the skin that's different.
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Old 12-05-2012, 10:28 AM   #22
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really good write up on why Window 8 sucks

http://www.useit.com/alertbox/windows-8.html
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Old 12-05-2012, 10:31 AM   #23
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Windows has never been intuitive, it's a learned system and with changes comes new things to learn.
Is any modern desktop operating system intuitive? I have seen people struggle with pretty much all of them. I would say like any complex tool, all modern operating systems are learned systems.
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Old 12-05-2012, 10:33 AM   #24
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really good write up on why Window 8 sucks

http://www.useit.com/alertbox/windows-8.html
That article really only describes why the Metro interface sucks for PC users. It really doesn't address the core operating system at all.
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Old 12-05-2012, 11:57 AM   #25
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My wife plugs our printer (USB) into the Ethernet port on her PC and complains that the printer is broken. But she's happily on Windows 8.

I asked her the other day if she wanted to go back to 7 and she said "Why?". So i left it at that. That's a perfect example of someone who knows "Sweet F all" about the modern PC and she's perfectly fine moving from W7 to Windows 8. The only tweaks we did to her system was to remove the default Music and photo app and all is good.

Stick to 7 if you can't understand W8, but i'd say most cases are people not bothering to even use it than not understanding how to use it.
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