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Old 11-26-2012, 09:13 AM   #1
rfeirstein
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Angry Is it Me or is it HP?

I have worked on 2 recent HP desktops, one sporting an i3 and the other an i7 CPU. Both demonstrated the same design problem that I assume is intentional but may not be known to upper management.

I tried to update the new desktops by adding in a brand new SSD as the boot drive.

On the i3 desktop HP's restore version of Windows 7 loaded as did my retail version of Windows 7. But in both cases the PC would not find the proper drivers to allow a full reboot of the desktop into Windows 7. I returned the PC and HP replaced the OEM HD and the mother board but the same problem was experienced again.

Yesterday, with the i7 I installed a new SSD as the boot drive. This time HP's restore Windows 7 software refused to load because it stated that the new drive was smaller than the OEM drive.
When I attempted to load my retail version of Windows 7 the install failed because the mouse and keyboard would not function. I hacked an initial install on another PC with this SSD and then tried to complete the install on the i7 HP desktop but Windows install could not find any drivers and aborted the install.

Just what is going to happen to the share holders of HP when its current crop of users find out that they cannot upgrade their hard drives or operating systems since HP has set the bios to only accept an HP version of Windows that they refuse to release to their users. The bios and mother boards have been designed to defeat efforts to upgrade. HP's Indian service people recommended that I spend over $100 so that HP could send out a service tech to install the needed software.
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Old 11-26-2012, 09:39 AM   #2
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I can only tell you that this usually is a PITA on laptops (you can't build laptops yourself in general).

I will need to google extensively but I think it will be ahrd as this procedure is more common on laptops. (Why buy a desktop from hp in the first place, just build it yourself).

I recommend doing a clean install. That however requires you have a Win 7 CD of the same version available (doesn't matter if it is for desktop, just enter the key of your laptop).

Also download any Win 7 services packs prior to doing this and install instantly after Win 7 base install.

Also download HP drivers from their website so you can then install them. Especially network driver.

That would be my general recommendation but no idea if it works.
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Old 11-26-2012, 09:46 AM   #3
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Its you. If you want a computer with an ssd I'm sure HP would be happy to sell you one.

You bought a computer with an operating system license for the computer as it was sold to you.

Neither HP or Microsoft have any obligation to service the computer if you modify it.
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Old 11-26-2012, 10:11 AM   #4
rfeirstein
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Hay, that's just what HP said to me. So it you buy an HP desktop, don't think about upgrading it with an SSD. Also, if you do a clean format of the OEM hard drive don't think about loading a retail version of Windows, just stick to the 4 disk set of DVD's you created from the restore utility HP provides with the desktop.

Do you actually think this is an acceptable business practice?
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Old 11-26-2012, 10:53 AM   #5
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It's very easy to upgrade the OS drive in a HP desktop. Just clone the existing desktop drive to he SSD, then replace the HDD with the SSD. I've done that many times - even on a HP laptop. The Restore function is designed to restore to the original factory drive. And, yes, that is acceptable business practice.
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Old 11-26-2012, 11:01 AM   #6
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thats because the restore stuff is on the hard drive in another partition. you need to clone the partitions over or get a restore DVD from HP .
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Old 11-26-2012, 01:01 PM   #7
rfeirstein
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HP does not provide a restore DVD but you can, and I did, create a 4 disk restore set of DVD's using the HP restore HD utility.

Just how do you clone the factory drive onto the SSD?
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Old 11-26-2012, 01:29 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rfeirstein View Post
HP does not provide a restore DVD but you can, and I did, create a 4 disk restore set of DVD's using the HP restore HD utility.
HP does not include a DVD recovery disk set with their current machines. Instead, they expect their users to use the built in utility to burn one. However, they do provide recovery/restore DVD's for most of their models at a nominal cost (~ $25$ plus shipping), at least until they're pretty far out of date.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rfeirstein View Post
Just how do you clone the factory drive onto the SSD?
Acronis True Image is a program that can "clone" your hard drive. That is, it makes an exact, running duplicate of your hard drive. If your main drive fails, the cloned image can directly replace the old drive, or it can be used to reload everything, including your operating files, on a new drive without re-installing the system or your programs. If your hard drive fails or becomes irreparably infected, it WILL save your butt, and it works with Vista and Windows 7. Presumably, the latest version should work with Windows 8.

Seagate and Western Digital offer free versions for their drives. In both cases, these branded versions require that at least one of the drives in the chain must be from the company offering the program. Seagate owns Maxtor so their version works for both brands. I don't know if there are any specific considerations when using these branded versions with SSD's.

Acronis True Image for Seagate drives.

Acronis True Image for Western Digital drives.
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Old 11-26-2012, 01:36 PM   #9
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I agree with Corkyg and Harvey. You need to clone the original drive over to the new SSD .. most programs, like Acronis, can clone from a larger drive to a smaller one, provided the smaller one has enough room for the entire partition being cloned over. Once that is done, just swap the drive and it should boot up just fine.
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Old 11-26-2012, 01:39 PM   #10
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Huh. I bought a Gateway G630 slimline desktop from Staples, and I had no trouble installing an SSD and a fresh copy of Windows 7 HP 64-bit, using media downloaded from DR, and using the key on the side of the case to activate.

I guess this means that you should avoid HP desktops?

Since Intel CPUs require Intel chipsets, and the drivers for Intel chipsets are standardized (for things like the USB ports for mouse and keyboard), I would think that HP must have gone out of their way to make it intentionally incompatible somehow.

I've always found Acer/Gateway/Emachines to use pretty standard hardware, and not pull any funny tricks.
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Old 11-26-2012, 06:52 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by corkyg View Post
It's very easy to upgrade the OS drive in a HP desktop. Just clone the existing desktop drive to he SSD, then replace the HDD with the SSD. I've done that many times - even on a HP laptop. The Restore function is designed to restore to the original factory drive. And, yes, that is acceptable business practice.
I was going to use Acronis 2013 to clone the hard drive on my new computer, but chickened out when it said something about resizing the partitions to make them fit. I also have a raid 0 set up. If I clone that, will there be a problem?
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Old 11-26-2012, 09:29 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frozentundra123456 View Post
I was going to use Acronis 2013 to clone the hard drive on my new computer, but chickened out when it said something about resizing the partitions to make them fit. I also have a raid 0 set up. If I clone that, will there be a problem?
1. Create and use bootable rescue media.
2, Do everything manually.
2. Use Proportional mode.

All will be done right.
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Old 11-26-2012, 11:28 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by corkyg View Post
1. Create and use bootable rescue media.
2, Do everything manually.
2. Use Proportional mode.

All will be done right.
Thanks, I did create bootable rescue media already using Acronis and also the Dell recovery tool.
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Old 11-27-2012, 12:25 AM   #14
jihe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rfeirstein View Post
I have worked on 2 recent HP desktops, one sporting an i3 and the other an i7 CPU. Both demonstrated the same design problem that I assume is intentional but may not be known to upper management.

I tried to update the new desktops by adding in a brand new SSD as the boot drive.

On the i3 desktop HP's restore version of Windows 7 loaded as did my retail version of Windows 7. But in both cases the PC would not find the proper drivers to allow a full reboot of the desktop into Windows 7. I returned the PC and HP replaced the OEM HD and the mother board but the same problem was experienced again.

Yesterday, with the i7 I installed a new SSD as the boot drive. This time HP's restore Windows 7 software refused to load because it stated that the new drive was smaller than the OEM drive.
When I attempted to load my retail version of Windows 7 the install failed because the mouse and keyboard would not function. I hacked an initial install on another PC with this SSD and then tried to complete the install on the i7 HP desktop but Windows install could not find any drivers and aborted the install.

Just what is going to happen to the share holders of HP when its current crop of users find out that they cannot upgrade their hard drives or operating systems since HP has set the bios to only accept an HP version of Windows that they refuse to release to their users. The bios and mother boards have been designed to defeat efforts to upgrade. HP's Indian service people recommended that I spend over $100 so that HP could send out a service tech to install the needed software.
Probably best to do a clean install anyway.
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Old 11-30-2012, 03:13 PM   #15
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I did a clean install on a new pavilion notebook and the chipset drivers failed to work from HP's website....not a happy camper.
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Old 11-30-2012, 05:04 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom View Post
Its you. If you want a computer with an ssd I'm sure HP would be happy to sell you one.

You bought a computer with an operating system license for the computer as it was sold to you.

Neither HP or Microsoft have any obligation to service the computer if you modify it.
Applying this logic to RAM, the CPU, etc, etc, it does not make sense. If you buy a machine that does as you command, I sure as hell would want one I can upgrade, especially if its a desktop.
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Old 12-02-2012, 03:39 PM   #17
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You need to stick with the generic Intel drivers as much as you can and in the best of time search what installed divers are on that machine then download to a flash drive for days like this.

Start, Control Panel, System if device manager isn't listed, then device manager, and at last hardware. Search each item as for the name of the device and Google each item. You should find generic drivers pretty easily that way, other than that if you are lucky HP and others might have a list of total hardware specs listed.
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Old 12-03-2012, 09:05 AM   #18
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I had zero problems using macrium reflect to clone my laptop drive to a smaller SSD on my HP probook.

http://www.macrium.com/reflectfree.aspx
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