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Old 11-13-2012, 07:07 PM   #26
futuristicmonkey
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Og8h_X9evXc
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Old 11-13-2012, 08:59 PM   #27
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Certain cars have an unavoidable image attached to them. This is one of those, and it isn't the image I'd want to project.

Joe Biden (The Onion) would probably be a fan, though.
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Old 11-13-2012, 09:48 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by Arkaign View Post
We all pretty much loved the LT1s/350 GM motors, I wonder why the 305 was so much suck compared to Ford's 302?
They were all weak. Ford's MAF 302 in fox bodies peaked at like 230hp. I don't remember if it improved in 1994-95, but I doubt it. 1996 brought the 4.6L.

Chevy made 305's rated in the low 200's. Chevy made 350's rated in the low 200's. I don't think any SBC broke 250hp until the LT1.

The biggest concern isn't in the 45ci of displacement. It's in the compression ratio, combustion chamber design, ect.
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Old 11-13-2012, 09:55 PM   #29
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If you have disposable income then maybe. But for $9000 I'd rather buy almost anything else.
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Old 11-13-2012, 10:04 PM   #30
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i bought my 85 for 2500, though not in as good of shape.

i like the cars, but I think it is over priced. I would love to have another one, and build it with sub frame connectors and a new, FI small block.

the aero qualities of these cars are pretty impressive.
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Old 11-13-2012, 10:15 PM   #31
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Damnit, I came here to post the Biden pic but I was beaten to it.

For $9k? No deal. My buddy drove a 91, and I'm pretty sure he didn't pay 9k for his back in the late 90's. No way this car appreciated that much, no matter how well it was maintained. And yes, between 80 and 100k is when shit starts to go bad on these. I'd love to drive it, just to hear that interior rattle and squeak. Nothing fit right on those cars.

I like this car, but I wouldn't pay more than 3k for it.
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Old 11-13-2012, 10:33 PM   #32
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Damnit, I came here to post the Biden pic but I was beaten to it.

For $9k? No deal. My buddy drove a 91, and I'm pretty sure he didn't pay 9k for his back in the late 90's. No way this car appreciated that much, no matter how well it was maintained. And yes, between 80 and 100k is when shit starts to go bad on these. I'd love to drive it, just to hear that interior rattle and squeak. Nothing fit right on those cars.

I like this car, but I wouldn't pay more than 3k for it.
They kind of have appreciated. There aren't many 'common' 60-70's muscle cars anymore. If you don't want to spend a ton, the best you can do is buy a low-level car...GM A-bodies like skylark, lemans; less-desirable years of chargers and dusters, ect. Highly produced and not that collectible cars.

...and you'd still pay less for a third gen F-body in nicer shape.

But people have apparently realized these price disparities, and your 80's cars are slowly becoming what the true 'muscle era' used to be in the 90's: lots of cars, but also lots of demand, and fairly original vehicles are getting pretty uncommon.

Anymore, it seems hard to find a 3rd gen (or a fox mustang) thats not a butchered piece of crap for less than 3-5k or so.
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Old 11-14-2012, 07:57 AM   #33
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We all pretty much loved the LT1s/350 GM motors, I wonder why the 305 was so much suck compared to Ford's 302?
305's were turds.

The ford 302 has a 4" bore and a 3" stroke, which makes for a high winding engine.

The chevy 305 has a 3.74" bore and a 3.48 stroke which makes for a good low rpm engine, but it tends to drop off above 5000 rpm.

Also because of the smaller bore in a 305, the heads are limited in possible valve size and the chamber wall somewhat shrouds the intake valve, limiting performance applications for the 305, whereas the larger bore of the 302 allows for larger valves with better flow.
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Old 11-14-2012, 08:07 AM   #34
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Originally Posted by phucheneh View Post
They kind of have appreciated. There aren't many 'common' 60-70's muscle cars anymore. If you don't want to spend a ton, the best you can do is buy a low-level car...GM A-bodies like skylark, lemans; less-desirable years of chargers and dusters, ect. Highly produced and not that collectible cars.

...and you'd still pay less for a third gen F-body in nicer shape.

But people have apparently realized these price disparities, and your 80's cars are slowly becoming what the true 'muscle era' used to be in the 90's: lots of cars, but also lots of demand, and fairly original vehicles are getting pretty uncommon.

Anymore, it seems hard to find a 3rd gen (or a fox mustang) thats not a butchered piece of crap for less than 3-5k or so.
Wow. Well, if that's the case, I wonder what I can get for my 91 Supra Turbo, all stock, all original parts. No offense to that set of enthusiasts, but the Supra had all of the straight line performance with better handling and a far nicer interior. Still, I doubt I could ask 9k for my car.

When I was in high school, a late 80's F-Body was what you'd buy if you wanted a fast piece of shit. One step up from the fox body mustang, which was essentially an engine with a seat bolted to it.

The only muscle cars of that era that I'd put a premium on are the 89 TTA and the various turbo Regals/Grand National.
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Old 11-14-2012, 08:45 AM   #35
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These cars are under-engineered, just like most GM cars back then
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Old 11-14-2012, 09:41 AM   #36
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Mid 80's - early 90's Ford 302 = Balls and a lot of fun
Mid 80's to early 90's GM 305 = tick tick tick tick tick tick tick tick tick tick VAAAAAARRRROOOOOOOOOMM tick tick tick tick tick.

I think the 5spd they used with the 305 was the same one they paired with 2.8 v6.

The younger folks who only have spec sheets and experiences in old worn out examples to go by might not understand that these were a lot of fun back in the 80's and early 90's.
Very visceral cars.
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Old 11-14-2012, 09:43 AM   #37
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These cars are under-engineered, just like most GM cars back then
What made it even worse is that "booming" stereo systems weren't the norm when these came out so you the crappy radio couldn't quite cut it for drowning out the rattles and squeaks.
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Old 11-14-2012, 09:52 AM   #38
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I'd be happy to get half that price for my 85 Vette.
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Old 11-14-2012, 01:02 PM   #39
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I like the C4 a lot. But why's it in the grass? The driveway's open!
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Old 11-14-2012, 03:00 PM   #40
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I like the C4 a lot. But why's it in the grass? The driveway's open!
Didn't those have the digital dashboards that you had to replace every 3 years?
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Old 11-14-2012, 03:03 PM   #41
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These cars are under-engineered, just like most GM cars back then
nice stupid factless blanket statement there
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Old 11-14-2012, 03:13 PM   #42
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[img]http://4**************.com/_83rZEgX6bQY/SarjrGj3SFI/AAAAAAAAGRw/2SfZ7RHcPQQ/s400/dang+dirt.jpg[/img]
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Old 11-14-2012, 03:20 PM   #43
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I like the C4 a lot. But why's it in the grass? The driveway's open!
SHADE! it was hotter than hell when I took that pic.
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Old 11-14-2012, 03:23 PM   #44
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Didn't those have the digital dashboards that you had to replace every 3 years?
Probably...if you didn't take care of it. I bought mine in 92 and it still works. SORRY!
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Old 11-14-2012, 04:24 PM   #45
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Quote:
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nice stupid factless blanket statement there
It's not stupid and factless. It's worth keeping in mind that it's going to rattle and feel like garbage just like the other pieces of junk the GM beancounters built in the 80s and 90s.
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Old 11-14-2012, 06:13 PM   #46
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Why anyone would buy that pile of crap rattle box when you could get an early 90s Vette with lower mileage for the same money is beyond me.

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-s...33956025&Log=0

Oh, and that 305ci engine made around 190hp back in 1986 IIRC.
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Old 11-14-2012, 06:21 PM   #47
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Probably...if you didn't take care of it. I bought mine in 92 and it still works. SORRY!
LOL- how do you take care of a digital dash? I think they were just known for fizzling out, leaving you with no gauges. You probably have a good one
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Old 11-14-2012, 06:24 PM   #48
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LOL- how do you take care of a digital dash? I think they were just known for fizzling out, leaving you with no gauges. You probably have a good one
No kidding. It either works or it doesn't.
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Old 11-14-2012, 06:45 PM   #49
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LOL- how do you take care of a digital dash? I think they were just known for fizzling out, leaving you with no gauges. You probably have a good one
Uh dude, you gotta replace the oil...
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Old 11-14-2012, 07:04 PM   #50
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80's GM's feel the same as 70's GM's to me. No one complains about the shitty interior on a 'classic'...I mean, you might love the look, but the materials, fitment, ect are all going to be generally worse than most any modern car.

Cardboard door panels with some carpet remnants and some poor quality vinyl. Maybe a metal strip or two. Awful plastic consoles and dash pieces. Cardboard glove boxes. Ect.

80's GM's, as least F-bodies and most full frame cars, are pretty solid. My firebird still felt like a big metal tank to me. Much the same as my previous 70's A-body, just with more grip.

The late 80's FWD on into a lot of the 90's is what is really awful GM. Starting to build things 'new school' but it took them a while to get remotely decent at it. Early 90's GM FWD....uggghhh...arguably set the bar for cheap, squeaky shittiness. But it was a competitive (in shittiness) market.

I dunno why the 'vette prices tank so much. I guess the relative 'exotic' nature next to other front engine, RWD candidates of the period probably shrinks the market...80's G and F bodies can be used like 60-70's muscle cars- it's just a simple, fairly sturdy rolling platform for whatever engine you wanna stick in it.
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