Go Back   AnandTech Forums > Social > Off Topic

Forums
· Hardware and Technology
· CPUs and Overclocking
· Motherboards
· Video Cards and Graphics
· Memory and Storage
· Power Supplies
· Cases & Cooling
· SFF, Notebooks, Pre-Built/Barebones PCs
· Networking
· Peripherals
· General Hardware
· Highly Technical
· Computer Help
· Home Theater PCs
· Consumer Electronics
· Digital and Video Cameras
· Mobile Devices & Gadgets
· Audio/Video & Home Theater
· Software
· Software for Windows
· All Things Apple
· *nix Software
· Operating Systems
· Programming
· PC Gaming
· Console Gaming
· Distributed Computing
· Security
· Social
· Off Topic
· Politics and News
· Discussion Club
· Love and Relationships
· The Garage
· Health and Fitness
· Merchandise and Shopping
· For Sale/Trade
· Hot Deals with Free Stuff/Contests
· Black Friday 2013
· Forum Issues
· Technical Forum Issues
· Personal Forum Issues
· Suggestion Box
· Moderator Resources
· Moderator Discussions
   

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 11-12-2012, 01:57 PM   #1
GWestphal
Golden Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,109
Default YA(Gun)T: Modern M-6 Scout?

I was looking at survival guns and was trying to find a .22LR/20 gauge combo (the 2 most common rounds) , but it seems like nobody produces one these days.

I saw the M-6 Scout, but it seems a bit too spartan.

I have two relatively dumb questions.

1) The M-6 is nice in that it has 3 parts, barrel, pin, and stock. Obviously a semi auto will have a more complicated action. Is there a way to create an action that can be single shot or semi auto? I'm thinking in the case that the semi auto action breaks (hard to maintain during zombie apocalypse) it would still be usable for single shot?

2) How is the accuracy on these things? Could you get Savage nail driver accuracy?

One that was a little more comfortable would be great too.
GWestphal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2012, 02:34 PM   #2
CurseTheSky
Diamond Member
 
CurseTheSky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 5,266
Default

The M6 is all about simplicity and ease of use. That's why it's not comfortable or ergonomic by any means, but fairly easy to lug around and comparatively easy to use in full Winter gear (mittens) or if injured, due to the trigger bar. It's kind of like an old Jeep Wrangler. I have seen several examples wrapped in paracord for increased comfort.

For a modern equivalent, I don't know of any .22LR / shotgun combos, but you could look into something like a Ruger 10/22 Takedown (my wife has one, we both love it) or a Marlin Papoose. The AR-7 is another option, but quality has been hit and miss. The advantage of all of those is the fact that they're semi-auto, so follow-up shots are much easier. The safeties (as far as I know) are much more standard as well, vs. the M6 which has a multi-position hammer used as the shot selector and the safety.
__________________
We're all going to die someday, regardless of race, gender, beliefs, or any other differences.

The where, when, and how are things that we can try to control, but in the end, it's the mark that we leave on this world that we truly have power over.
CurseTheSky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2012, 02:43 PM   #3
irishScott
Lifer
 
irishScott's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Delaware
Posts: 20,421
Default

Marlin Papoose: http://www.marlinfirearms.com/firear...ding/70pss.asp
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=32FgaIb66bM

Not a shotgun combo, but about the best .22 survival rifle on the market IMO.
irishScott is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2012, 02:48 PM   #4
rommelrommel
Golden Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,539
Default

Most semis can be manually cycled without a ton of effort. Whether they can fire after something breaks depends on what broke.
rommelrommel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2012, 02:52 PM   #5
LTC8K6
Lifer
 
LTC8K6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Under an American chemtrail
Posts: 18,066
Default

Savage 42?
__________________
no offense, but does he have some sort of mental dissability? -nick1985

Brainwashed, mentally unstable, and stupid Intel user, screwed by Intel and located directly under a chemtrail.

Don't be a moron! Buy AMD!
LTC8K6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2012, 02:57 PM   #6
GWestphal
Golden Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,109
Default

The 42 looks kinda cool, but isn't chambered for 20 gauge, how easy with .410 ammo be to find if it all goes to crap?
GWestphal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2012, 03:39 PM   #7
LTC8K6
Lifer
 
LTC8K6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Under an American chemtrail
Posts: 18,066
Default

12 gauge is the most common shotgun size. 20 is next. .410 is third.

I wouldn't expect trouble finding these sizes as places like Wal-mart stock them all.

You can always stock up and rotate your stock to keep fresher rounds on hand for the apocalypse.
__________________
no offense, but does he have some sort of mental dissability? -nick1985

Brainwashed, mentally unstable, and stupid Intel user, screwed by Intel and located directly under a chemtrail.

Don't be a moron! Buy AMD!
LTC8K6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2012, 03:42 PM   #8
LTC8K6
Lifer
 
LTC8K6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Under an American chemtrail
Posts: 18,066
Default

http://eaacorp.com/portfolio-item/mp...-shotgunrifle/

.223 rem and 12 gauge.
__________________
no offense, but does he have some sort of mental dissability? -nick1985

Brainwashed, mentally unstable, and stupid Intel user, screwed by Intel and located directly under a chemtrail.

Don't be a moron! Buy AMD!
LTC8K6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2012, 03:49 PM   #9
LTC8K6
Lifer
 
LTC8K6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Under an American chemtrail
Posts: 18,066
Default

http://www.gandermountain.com/modper...056195&uf=true

This used to be available and might still be if you look around. Maybe find a used one?
__________________
no offense, but does he have some sort of mental dissability? -nick1985

Brainwashed, mentally unstable, and stupid Intel user, screwed by Intel and located directly under a chemtrail.

Don't be a moron! Buy AMD!
LTC8K6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2012, 05:22 PM   #10
pontifex
Lifer
 
pontifex's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: PA
Posts: 40,649
Default

Henry makes a small survival rifle .22. Saw a used one at Gander Mtn. the other day and the stock seemed really cheap/thin
pontifex is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2012, 11:17 PM   #11
Agent11
Diamond Member
 
Agent11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Oregon
Posts: 3,535
Default

If you are seriously looking for a survival rifle the lee enfield is about the best you can get for the money. Higher magazine capacity than most all modern rifles, smooth action, large caliber.

Indian Ishapore in .308/7.62nato(10-12 rounds depending on year of mfr.) was manufactured up until the 70's iirc last bolt action manufactured for a standing army, or the British Mkiii and mkiv in .303(10rnd) served in wwi and wwii, they even tried to have it banned as too brutal for civilized combat due to the damage inflicted by the .303 British round.



You can get one in excellent shape for around 150-300 depending on whether it is still in stock form and if the serials all match.

www.gunbroker.com

http://www.armslist.com/classifieds/...g=308-762-nato

You can get mil surplus ammo for plinking / end of the world storage, and they still manufacture expanding ammunition for hunting... And if all else fails you have a bayonet.
__________________
-11

Last edited by Agent11; 11-12-2012 at 11:29 PM.
Agent11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2012, 11:23 PM   #12
Fayd
Diamond Member
 
Fayd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Around
Posts: 7,583
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Agent11 View Post
If you are seriously looking for a survival rifle the lee enfield is about the best you can get for the money. Higher magazine capacity than most all modern rifles, smooth action, large caliber.

Indian Ishapore in .308/7.62nato was manufactured up until the 70's iirc last bolt action manufactured for a standing army, or the British Mkiii and mkiv in .303 served in wwi and wwii, they even tried to have it banned as too brutal for civilized combat due to the damage inflicted by the .303 British round.

You can get one in excellent shape for around 150-300 depending on whether it is still in stock form and if the serials all match.

www.gunbroker.com

http://www.armslist.com/classifieds/...g=308-762-nato

You can get mil surplus ammo for plinking / end of the world storage, and they still manufacture expanding ammunition for hunting.
i think your definition of survival rifle is completely different from his definition.
__________________
Hold me closer Tony Danza
Count the Headlights on the Highway
Lay me down in sheets of linen
You've had a busy day today.
Fayd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2012, 11:33 PM   #13
Agent11
Diamond Member
 
Agent11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Oregon
Posts: 3,535
Default

Perhaps. I would be confident in my ability to feed myself and my family, and defend my home with an enfield though... Not so much with a 22/20.

But we have elk, bear, deer, mountain goats, bighorn sheep and mountain lions in Oregon.. If all you have available is squirrels,chipmunks and pigeons then yea.. I could see not needing much firepower.
__________________
-11

Last edited by Agent11; 11-12-2012 at 11:38 PM.
Agent11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2012, 11:46 PM   #14
Fayd
Diamond Member
 
Fayd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Around
Posts: 7,583
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Agent11 View Post
Perhaps. I would be confident in my ability to feed myself and my family, and defend my home with an enfield though... Not so much with a 22/20.

But we have elk, bear, deer, mountain goats, bighorn sheep and mountain lions in Oregon.. If all you have available is squirrels,chipmunks and pigeons then yea.. I could see not needing much firepower.
the M6 is more about utility than pure killing power. it's meant for survival for a single person for a limited period of time. it folds up small, holds a small amount of ammo, and will allow you to live in some relative comfort for said small period of time.

besides, your singing the praises of the enfield is unwarranted. it's inaccurate, relatively hard to get ammo for it in the US, and kind of ugly. if you're gonna suggest a bolt action larger caliber rifle in the US for hunting post-civilization, then i'd suggest a stainless barrel remington 700, in whatever caliber is most appropriate to the game near you. .30-06 is fine for anything in the continental US.
__________________
Hold me closer Tony Danza
Count the Headlights on the Highway
Lay me down in sheets of linen
You've had a busy day today.
Fayd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2012, 11:52 PM   #15
Agent11
Diamond Member
 
Agent11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Oregon
Posts: 3,535
Default

The ammo is very easy to get, especially for the ishapore. And it can be very accurate, certainly within normal hunting ranges. If you try to take a big horn at 1000 yards you had better have a good scope and be sighted in, but it isn't unreasonable.

It's just an extremely versatile package that is inexpensive, with inexpensive bulk ammo available. Worth consideration.
__________________
-11

Last edited by Agent11; 11-12-2012 at 11:57 PM.
Agent11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-2012, 12:03 AM   #16
rommelrommel
Golden Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,539
Default

Ok, now you're just bullshitting. 1000 yards? ell-oh-ell
rommelrommel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-2012, 12:07 AM   #17
Agent11
Diamond Member
 
Agent11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Oregon
Posts: 3,535
Default

It is imminently possible. Check youtube. there are tons of videos of enfields shooting at those ranges.

I don't have a scope for mine atm, but when I find one that I don't have to cut the stock to mount I'd be happy to prove it.
__________________
-11
Agent11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-2012, 12:18 AM   #18
rommelrommel
Golden Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,539
Default

Shooting what exactly at 1000 yards? I hope steel because that's a highly improbable shot for a lee enfield on a game animal... that's about 2 moa for a 20" circle at 1000 yards assuming your corrections for wind/distance/angle are PERFECT which they will not be.

Quote:
So what do the experts say about LE accuracy?

Skennerton, Lee Enfield Story (1993ed.), p212:

“Accuracy tests for the No. 4 sniper rifle involved placing 7 out of 7 shots within a 5 inch diameter at 200 yards & 6 out of 7 shots into a 10 inch diameter at 400yards.”

From this report then the minimum standard for No. 4 “T” sniper rifles was 2.5 MOA out to 400 yards for at least 6 shots. In the case of the “T” series of rifles, these pieces were hand picked to begin with and then worked over completely by an armourer in order to maximize the accuracy potential. The rifles were still feed service issue Mk VII ammunition though my understanding is precision shooters used a “gauging system” to measure all ammo to allow rounds to be sorted into batches for peak performance. No doubt tailoring a specific handload to each rifle would have allowed for a greater degree of accuracy again but of course in times of conflict this is not practical. A latter day standard is a generic premium load IE: US GI National Match ammo. Sniper rifles aside what can a “standard” issue SMLE or No.4 rifle be expected to produce in MOA terms with Mk VII ammunition (174gr Spitzer bullet at 2440fps)?
So, a hand picked and not 70 year old no. 4 sniper rifle was 2.5 moa or better at 400 yards. Handloads could push that, but not enough most likely. 1000 yards on a game animal with ANY rifle is a marginal shot unless it's a dead still day, you have a good rest, good rangefinder, extensive experience shooting at that range, and everything goes your way. Shooting that far on a rifle that simply is not inherently accurate is just silly.
rommelrommel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-2012, 12:27 AM   #19
Agent11
Diamond Member
 
Agent11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Oregon
Posts: 3,535
Default

I never said it was 'the most accurate rifle.' It can hit with deadly force out to 1000 yards, and you can expect to have a reasonable chance of hitting at that range if you are practiced in it and have a good barrel and a good scope.

However that isn't even the main issue. It was claimed that it is an 'inaccurate rifle' it is not.

Manufacture of the ishapore started in 63 and ended in 75, and the Brits stopped production in the 60's, there are still many Enfield's in excellent condition.
__________________
-11

Last edited by Agent11; 11-13-2012 at 12:31 AM.
Agent11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-2012, 12:43 AM   #20
rommelrommel
Golden Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,539
Default

They're inaccurate relative to almost every bolt action on the shelves today so I think it was a fair comment. They're cheap and they do have a fast action and a big magazine. When you can pick up a tikka or several other rifles for around 700 bucks that guarantee sub moa performance (and have modern scope mounts) I don't know why you'd consider shooting an enfield at that range unless it's all you had and your life was riding on it.
rommelrommel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-2012, 12:45 AM   #21
Agent11
Diamond Member
 
Agent11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Oregon
Posts: 3,535
Default

'fun' is the only good reason really.

When considering a 'survival' weapon though I would consider cheap bulk ammo to be a plus as well.
__________________
-11

Last edited by Agent11; 11-13-2012 at 12:47 AM.
Agent11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-2012, 12:49 AM   #22
OverVolt
Diamond Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 9,918
Default

I never even knew these existed, and... this is an interesting concept lol.
OverVolt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-2012, 01:16 AM   #23
Agent11
Diamond Member
 
Agent11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Oregon
Posts: 3,535
Default

http://www.savagearms.com/firearms/model/Model42

This looks like it could slay some quail and squirells. 410 bore though... Although isn't the scout 410 as well?

Here are a bunch of savage combo guns, I don't think many are still in production though.
http://www.gunsinternational.com/Sav...cfm?cat_id=574

Some .22/20's in that list, spendy though.

search .22/20 camper on some auction sites and you'll find an older model for less... Still overpriced for what they are imo.

http://www.armslist.com/classifieds/...earch=.22%2F20

You would be better off with a good double barrel 12 gauge for ducks and geese and a good 22 rifle for small game. Would be less expensive too I bet.
__________________
-11

Last edited by Agent11; 11-13-2012 at 02:12 AM.
Agent11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-2012, 07:54 AM   #24
pontifex
Lifer
 
pontifex's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: PA
Posts: 40,649
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fayd View Post
the M6 is more about utility than pure killing power. it's meant for survival for a single person for a limited period of time. it folds up small, holds a small amount of ammo, and will allow you to live in some relative comfort for said small period of time.

besides, your singing the praises of the enfield is unwarranted. it's inaccurate, relatively hard to get ammo for it in the US, and kind of ugly. if you're gonna suggest a bolt action larger caliber rifle in the US for hunting post-civilization, then i'd suggest a stainless barrel remington 700, in whatever caliber is most appropriate to the game near you. .30-06 is fine for anything in the continental US.
he's talking about .308 chambered Enfields, not .303, or at least that's what I believe he is saying. If he's talking about .303, then, yeah, bullshit on the surplus ammo. that has dried up a long time ago. you can still get commercial .303 though.
pontifex is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-13-2012, 08:05 AM   #25
Agent11
Diamond Member
 
Agent11's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Oregon
Posts: 3,535
Default

http://ammoseek.com/?gun=rifle&cal=159 7.62 nato

You can get 1000 rounds of 7.62nato pretty inexpensive, and you can still find people with lots of .303 who decide to sell off what they have.. Just have to keep your nose to the wind.
__________________
-11

Last edited by Agent11; 11-13-2012 at 08:09 AM.
Agent11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:17 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.