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Old 11-12-2012, 05:23 PM   #26
loki8481
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the Supreme Court really just needs to strike down the Defense of Marriage Act and call it a day.

I'd be fine with leaving gay marriage up to the states, but DOMA mandating that the Federal government can't recognize same-sex marriage just causes way too many issues (benefits for federal employees, being able to get a green card for an immigrant spouse, any kind of custody/divorce issue that crosses state borders, etc..)
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Old 11-12-2012, 05:23 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Jadow View Post
Ok, this last election caused me to do some introspection and I've re-evaluated some positions I've held for a long time. Hopefully my fellow republicans can do the same.

Taxes - I used to be against any tax increases, I've thrown in the towel on that one, and don't think these changes will kill anyone. Go ahead and expire the Bush tax cuts for households over 250k, and let cap gains go up. Leave dividend rate alone. Eliminate EITC so people can't get a bigger refund than what they paid in.
I think the republicans are right to hold the line against any tax increases. When we're running trillion dollar yearly deficits, I don't see how the government can make the argument that it deserves to have its allowance increased.

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Healthcare - repealing Obamacare ain't going to happen, let it go. Try to make tweaks, and common sense changes when we can. Still need tort reform.
Mostly agree.

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Gay Marriage - let the states do what they want to do, it's not a federal issue. If it becomes a federal issue, just let the gays marry. I haven't really changed on this point.
It is already a state issue. To me that's not the problem. The problem lies in that the left draws no distinction between opposition to gay marriage and hating gay people. The last thing they do is take the opposition seriously.

I'm sure many on the left are happy to keep it a state issue. As long as the right keeps its mouth shut.

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Abortion - I'm pro life and will always be, but am ok with it for rape, incest, or LIFE of the mother (not "health" of the mother since that is too vague and they could say anything is for the "health").
Entirely agree, and if we could get within 200 miles of this in policy it would be a 3000% improvement. It is the left who is extreme on abortion, tolerating not the slightest restriction at the federal level.

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Contraception, this was a ridiculous argument all along. people can do whatever they want, I just don't think the tax payer needs to subsidize it. The Repubs did not articulate this position well at all.
Agree.

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Immigration, Secure borders, create a path to citizenship for illegals, but put them in the back of the line. The first step on the path is getting them SSNs and into the tax system so they aren't part of a cash based labor black market. Don't make them leave the country like Romney said.

Defense - cut spending, reduce the number of flag officers.

Medicare and Social Security - phase in age increases, do not increase payroll tax

Deficit - cutting spending should be the primary method of reducing it, with some tax increases (as mentioned above). All for a balanced budget amendment with a cap on what % of GDP government spending is.
Agree, except for tax increases.

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PBS, NPR, and the NEA - eliminate federal funding for them, they are not valuable enough that we need to borrow money to pay for them.

Are any of these radical right wing ideas? I think this would be a winning platform for repubs, and most of them are not to far off from what most repubs believe, they just need to do some tweaking IMO.
Agree.
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Old 11-12-2012, 05:28 PM   #28
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That's pretty well in line with my beliefs. I am a little more pro-abortion and gay marriage though. Repealing the 250K Bush tax cuts will only bring in another 100K in revenue so drastic spending cuts are in order.
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Old 11-12-2012, 06:19 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by Jadow View Post
Ok, this last election caused me to do some introspection and I've re-evaluated some positions I've held for a long time. Hopefully my fellow republicans can do the same.

Taxes - I used to be against any tax increases, I've thrown in the towel on that one, and don't think these changes will kill anyone. Go ahead and expire the Bush tax cuts for households over 250k, and let cap gains go up. Leave dividend rate alone. Eliminate EITC so people can't get a bigger refund than what they paid in.
The point of EITC is to effectively replace other methods of welfare distribution. it promotes people becoming productive members of society, getting their asses OFF welfare.

we need to eliminate long term welfare (short term is fine. maybe 3-6 month?) and have EITC for longer term help. (3 years maybe?)

the point of EITC is that it promotes activity, not laziness. leave it in.

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Healthcare - repealing Obamacare ain't going to happen, let it go. Try to make tweaks, and common sense changes when we can. Still need tort reform.

Gay Marriage - let the states do what they want to do, it's not a federal issue. If it becomes a federal issue, just let the gays marry. I haven't really changed on this point.


Abortion - I'm pro life and will always be, but am ok with it for rape, incest, or LIFE of the mother (not "health" of the mother since that is too vague and they could say anything is for the "health").
Health insurance mandate without a public option is an absolutely fucked up idea. a public option on the other hand creates a huge unbalance and will result in long lines and economized care. both ways are fucked. the system we have now is fucked. no good options exist.

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Contraception, this was a ridiculous argument all along. people can do whatever they want, I just don't think the tax payer needs to subsidize it. The Repubs did not articulate this position well at all.
agree with you there.

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Immigration, Secure borders, create a path to citizenship for illegals, but put them in the back of the line. The first step on the path is getting them SSNs and into the tax system so they aren't part of a cash based labor black market. Don't make them leave the country like Romney said.
people here illegally shouldn't get the advantages that citizenship grants. legal residents maybe, but not citizens.


that's enough responses.

Basically, in its making allies of special interest groups and seeking to satisfy longtime allies (the religious right, for example) the republican party has alienated the potential electorate and any chance they had of holding the presidency until they learn to change their platform.
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Old 11-12-2012, 06:30 PM   #30
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Immigration, Secure borders, create a path to citizenship for illegals, but put them in the back of the line. The first step on the path is getting them SSNs and into the tax system so they aren't part of a cash based labor black market. Don't make them leave the country like Romney said.

.

I want to go a step further. Pick the BEST of the BEST out of those ILLEGALS and those that could fulfill our country needs can stay but they HAVE to go to the back of the line AND stay out of trouble, pay all back taxes and fees in the meanwhile.

The rest (uneducated, no skill, can't speak English) can go back on their own. We do not need to spend a dime if we have the gut to enforce our current immigration law (no employment, no housing, no school for ILLEGALS).

Oh, revoke the Anchor Baby amendment while we are at it.

As I said several times before in other threads, we must open our doors to the smart folks around the world to come in and they could create the next Google/Yahoo/Intel/PayPal (those are companies that are found/co found by LEGAL immigrants), not more peasants to compete with our citizens for menial jobs.
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Old 11-12-2012, 06:35 PM   #31
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This is the reason Republicans will always be wacko. How much is the budget of PBS that it is even worthy of discussion. My gosh, focus energy on things that matter like tax subsidies for oil companies. There is always some dogma republicans rally behind without even an understanding of why.
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Old 11-12-2012, 06:39 PM   #32
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This is the reason Republicans will always be wacko. How much is the budget of PBS that it is even worthy of discussion. My gosh, focus energy on things that matter like tax subsidies for oil companies. There is always some dogma republicans rally behind without even an understanding of why.
wasted money is wasted money. No matter how large or small.
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Old 11-12-2012, 06:40 PM   #33
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The point of EITC is to effectively replace other methods of welfare distribution. it promotes people becoming productive members of society, getting their asses OFF welfare.

we need to eliminate long term welfare (short term is fine. maybe 3-6 month?) and have EITC for longer term help. (3 years maybe?)

the point of EITC is that it promotes activity, not laziness. leave it in.
The EITC is essentially welfare under a Republican approved name.

Really the whole safety net needs to be change to stop rewarding people for popping out children they cannot afford.

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Basically, in its making allies of special interest groups and seeking to satisfy longtime allies (the religious right, for example) the republican party has alienated the potential electorate and any chance they had of holding the presidency until they learn to change their platform.
Yeah because Democrats do not have special interest groups.

Women
LGBT
Blacks
Illegal immigrants
Unions

In fact I believe Barack Obama had a whole list of the special groups he supports on his website.
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Old 11-12-2012, 06:41 PM   #34
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All illegals should be permanently barred for US citizenship. If we cant deport them grant them legal residency, but not citizenship.
your position is one that just keeps on giving to us Democrats.....
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Old 11-12-2012, 06:49 PM   #35
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Like a couple others, I'd only really offer the critique that even mentioning NPR/PBS/NEA is a losing issue. I know lots of people think they are a waste or should have to compete in the market, but it's just a mistake to even bother going after them. The amount of money it would "save" ignores the value that it delivers to the public and politicizes things like Sesame Street, which as we just saw, is not an issue with vast support.

Building a platform on the big battles and issues is vastly more appealing than looking like a bully to the nerds who make This American Life and Masterpiece Theater.
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Old 11-12-2012, 06:59 PM   #36
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The EITC is essentially welfare under a Republican approved name.

Really the whole safety net needs to be change to stop rewarding people for popping out children they cannot afford.
No, I fully agree with that. that wasn't my point.

If we agree that a safety net needs to exist (in some form)(it probably should), then the incentivizing nature of EITC makes it a superior form of welfare to standard welfare. besides, it's cheap as hell to implement.

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Yeah because Democrats do not have special interest groups.

Women
LGBT
Blacks
Illegal immigrants
Unions

In fact I believe Barack Obama had a whole list of the special groups he supports on his website.
i'm well aware of that. and democrats have so effectively convinced each of their special interest groups that what's good for one is good for another, and any attack on any of them is an attack on all of them.

i had a point, but i'm too lazy to finish it.
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Old 11-12-2012, 07:31 PM   #37
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Anyone wanting to cut PBS must not have kids. Being able to put something on television for my child without him getting exposed to a barrage of advertisements for plastic junk and junk food cereal is worth far more than the 1 jet fighter plane a year that money would otherwise buy.
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Old 11-12-2012, 07:32 PM   #38
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Anyone wanting to cut PBS must not have kids. Being able to put something on television for my child without him getting exposed to a barrage of advertisements for plastic junk and junk food cereal is worth far more than the 1 jet fighter plane a year that money would otherwise buy.
worth so much you'd be willing to pay for it from a private company?
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Old 11-12-2012, 08:01 PM   #39
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wasted money is wasted money. No matter how large or small.
Turn off Fox news. PBS gets around 225 million a year. The oil companies get subsidies worth around 4 billion a year. One F-22 jet costs 143 million, not including the cost of research and development.

But that is only a cost analysis. We are not talking about the benefits of PBS in terms in early education and child growth.

It's just a colossally stupid thing to be anchored to when you are making a post of your core republican beliefs.
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Old 11-12-2012, 08:02 PM   #40
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worth so much you'd be willing to pay for it from a private company?
You do know that the government funding primarily goes to support stations in rural areas. While we are at it why don't we cut off funding for libraries.
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Old 11-12-2012, 08:09 PM   #41
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No, I fully agree with that. that wasn't my point.

If we agree that a safety net needs to exist (in some form)(it probably should), then the incentivizing nature of EITC makes it a superior form of welfare to standard welfare. besides, it's cheap as hell to implement.
Unfortunately, the money given away via EITC is used on big screen TVs, rims, etc. and not on daily needs and necessities by many who qualify for it.

I'd prefer we eliminate it and reform welfare to make it temporary and provide an emphasis on empowering those that use it to better themselves. If they fail to do so and the aid runs out they'll just have to seek help from private charities.
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Old 11-12-2012, 08:20 PM   #42
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Your post makes too much sense - be prepared to be cast out from the Republican base.
I agree with most of your post...I'd like to see jobs created by going up some on military spending and/or doing spending on NASA again - in hopes those would create new jobs.

But all in all, I'm a republican in many ways, but I am sick of hearing about abortion and gay marriage too...
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Old 11-12-2012, 08:34 PM   #43
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I also agree with the majority of what you've stated. Although I disagree with the position on Obamacare-I think it needs to be repealed and rewritten.

As far as immigration goes, I also agree we need to speed up the process for legal immigrants (I also immigrated my wife), but my stance on illegals is 1. they should be banned from ever becoming legal, and 2. instead of tackling the issue from the offender side (the illegals themselves) go after those who support them. Put in HARSH punishment for businesses and companies who are found to employ them, up to and including revoking business licenses. And for God's sake ENFORCE current laws. No more shelter cities.

But overall I dont think your views are extreme.
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Old 11-12-2012, 09:32 PM   #44
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Unfortunately, the money given away via EITC is used on big screen TVs, rims, etc. and not on daily needs and necessities by many who qualify for it.

I'd prefer we eliminate it and reform welfare to make it temporary and provide an emphasis on empowering those that use it to better themselves. If they fail to do so and the aid runs out they'll just have to seek help from private charities.
Please read this: http://www.chicagofed.org/digital_as...odman_etal.pdf

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Our primary finding is that recipient household spending in response to EITC payments is concentrated in vehicle purchases and transportation spending. Given the crucial link between transportation and access to jobs, we believe this finding is consistent with the EITC’s goals.
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The majority of research on the EITC and expenditure patterns has relied on surveys of EITC recipients about how they spent or planned to spend refunds. The consensus from these surveys is that the primary use of EITC refunds is to pay bills. Sixty-three percent of respondents in a survey of participants in the University of Georgia’s Consumer Financial Literacy Program reported that they planned to use most of their refund to pay or catch up on bills or debts (Linnenbrink et al., 2006). Similarly, 44 percent of mothers in a study tracking the well-being of rural families indicated that they used their refund to pay bills (Mammen and Lawrence, 2006). Using surveys of free tax preparation clients in Chicago, Smeeding, Phillips, and O’Connor (2000) report that tax filers who anticipate an EITC refund most often plan to use it to pay bills.

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Old 11-12-2012, 09:39 PM   #45
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To pay bills, but it doesn't say what those bills are fore? At least your quote doesn't.
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Old 11-12-2012, 09:40 PM   #46
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What did they qualify as "bills?" Do they consider credit cards "bills?" I have a friend with 3 kids who receives nearly a $7,000 refund every year thanks, in part, to EITC. He uses it to pay his credit card debt that he's racked up throughout the previous year buying video games, electronics, or hand guns that catch his eye.
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Old 11-12-2012, 09:51 PM   #47
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Yes, someone with those policies would have given Obama a run for his money. The real issue is that the republican brand has been tainted so extremely by first Bush, and then the Tea Party, that I don't know if people will ever trust them again. How can you argue for a moderate position when your party has refused to compromise on anything, putting party before the very nation they are supposed to represent?
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Old 11-12-2012, 10:58 PM   #48
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What did they qualify as "bills?" Do they consider credit cards "bills?" I have a friend with 3 kids who receives nearly a $7,000 refund every year thanks, in part, to EITC. He uses it to pay his credit card debt that he's racked up throughout the previous year buying video games, electronics, or hand guns that catch his eye.
Overlooked the transportation part, hmm?
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Old 11-13-2012, 12:05 AM   #49
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This is the reason Republicans will always be wacko. How much is the budget of PBS that it is even worthy of discussion. My gosh, focus energy on things that matter like tax subsidies for oil companies. There is always some dogma republicans rally behind without even an understanding of why.
Oil subsidies are a tiny fraction of the budget. Are you wacko?
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Old 11-13-2012, 12:24 AM   #50
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Overlooked the transportation part, hmm?
No, merely wondering about the "bills" part.

Transportation for those with lower income is a great thing. However, I'm not sure a tax credit they can spend carte blanche is the answer for that specific problem. I'd think better public transportation would be of a greater help.
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