Go Back   AnandTech Forums > Hardware and Technology > General Hardware

Forums
· Hardware and Technology
· CPUs and Overclocking
· Motherboards
· Video Cards and Graphics
· Memory and Storage
· Power Supplies
· Cases & Cooling
· SFF, Notebooks, Pre-Built/Barebones PCs
· Networking
· Peripherals
· General Hardware
· Highly Technical
· Computer Help
· Home Theater PCs
· Consumer Electronics
· Digital and Video Cameras
· Mobile Devices & Gadgets
· Audio/Video & Home Theater
· Software
· Software for Windows
· All Things Apple
· *nix Software
· Operating Systems
· Programming
· PC Gaming
· Console Gaming
· Distributed Computing
· Security
· Social
· Off Topic
· Politics and News
· Discussion Club
· Love and Relationships
· The Garage
· Health and Fitness
· Home and Garden
· Merchandise and Shopping
· For Sale/Trade
· Hot Deals with Free Stuff/Contests
· Black Friday 2014
· Forum Issues
· Technical Forum Issues
· Personal Forum Issues
· Suggestion Box
· Moderator Resources
· Moderator Discussions
   

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 11-09-2012, 10:38 AM   #1
Compman55
Golden Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,001
Default Chinese Laptop Batteries

I know they may not last as long, could have a shorter duration charge, or have a poor cosmetic appearance but can these cause damage or burn your house down?

In the past whenever I have purchased them, I only charge them while there, never unattended. But is this the only time lithium can be dangerous?

$90 for genuine, $16 shipped for chinese.
__________________
-Main: Fractal Arc Midi R2 | Z87-Pro | E3-1245V3 | 32GB | M500 240GB | Antec HCG-620m PSU | Win7x64 Pro | Dual Dell U2414H Borderless IPS Panels w/ MDS14 stand |
-HTPC: Mac mini | P7550 2.26 | 8GB | 500GB 7K500 | OS X 10.6.8 | Win7x64 Ultimate |
-Lappy: Dell Latitude D820 | C2D 2.0 | 2GB | 128GB Samsung 830 SSD | 15.4" WXGA | Win7 x86 Ultimate |
-Server: G2020 | 8GB | 500GB WD Black (OS)| 2x Seagate 4TB | 2x Segate 2TB |
Compman55 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2012, 11:38 AM   #2
JackMDS
Super Moderator
Elite Member
 
JackMDS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 1999
Posts: 26,560
Default

Hmm. I do not what the "Rumor Mill" churns on the Net but I use inexpensive Batteries in normal use in few Laptops (Mac @ Win) and every thing is OK.

There are few vendors that sell it in the USA for similar prices (may be few $$ higher) with 1-3 years warranty, that is giving the buyer an address and Tel. number to talk to if needed.

Example - http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-6-Cell-5...&forceRpt=true


__________________
Jack
Microsoft, MVP - Networking.
JackMDS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2012, 11:45 AM   #3
corkyg
Moderator
Peripherals
 
corkyg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Tucson, Arizona
Posts: 24,302
Default

Not sure what "Chinese" is supposed to mean. My Factory Lenovo batteries are Chinese, just as the Thinkpad is. The battery label says, "Cells made in Korea, Assembled and packed in China." I suspect OP means 3rd partry batteries made in China. Eh?
__________________
CorkyG - Tucson, AZ

“Excuses are the nails used to build a house of failure” - Don Wilder
corkyg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2012, 11:56 AM   #4
Compman55
Golden Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,001
Default

To clarify, I meant to say aftermarket non OEM cheap batteries from china / hong kong / korea.
__________________
-Main: Fractal Arc Midi R2 | Z87-Pro | E3-1245V3 | 32GB | M500 240GB | Antec HCG-620m PSU | Win7x64 Pro | Dual Dell U2414H Borderless IPS Panels w/ MDS14 stand |
-HTPC: Mac mini | P7550 2.26 | 8GB | 500GB 7K500 | OS X 10.6.8 | Win7x64 Ultimate |
-Lappy: Dell Latitude D820 | C2D 2.0 | 2GB | 128GB Samsung 830 SSD | 15.4" WXGA | Win7 x86 Ultimate |
-Server: G2020 | 8GB | 500GB WD Black (OS)| 2x Seagate 4TB | 2x Segate 2TB |
Compman55 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2012, 01:27 PM   #5
JackMDS
Super Moderator
Elite Member
 
JackMDS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 1999
Posts: 26,560
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Compman55 View Post
To clarify, I meant to say aftermarket non OEM cheap batteries from china / hong kong / korea.

Yeah it is a important point.


These days the amount of manafcturing done with most devices is so large that it is impossible to individually check every item. Thus what really matter is the statistical equations that are used in the QA (Quality Assurance) process.

The inexpensive aftermarket using much lower "treshhold" and thus it is much more variable in the quality of the hardware that they sell.

It can be the exact same hardware that is originally used for the Brand names but it is lacking the supervision and QA of the Brand names.

Foxconn buys the same stuff but they check the Batteries before they use it and they get rid of the "Bad" one before they put it in the Apple hardware. Apple might run additional QA with the finish product. That said we know even under such process Apple ended up with dangerous batteries in the market, but the probability to have troubles with the Apple hardware is lower than buying directly for the initial OEM.

The trick is to buy such hardware from a vendor in the US (not in the far east) US vendors are generally more careful since you can followup on them (even legally if needed).

With all the general pros and the cons, ebay is a better bet than independent sites for such purchases. You can find a vendor that is in the business long time and have good rating and thus reduce the risk, if needed the combo of eBay Paypal provides some help too in the disputed matter.



__________________
Jack
Microsoft, MVP - Networking.
JackMDS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2012, 01:42 PM   #6
Compman55
Golden Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,001
Default

For the small purchase price, I am not even concerned about quality.

I am more concerned about them shorting out the MB, or catching fire.
__________________
-Main: Fractal Arc Midi R2 | Z87-Pro | E3-1245V3 | 32GB | M500 240GB | Antec HCG-620m PSU | Win7x64 Pro | Dual Dell U2414H Borderless IPS Panels w/ MDS14 stand |
-HTPC: Mac mini | P7550 2.26 | 8GB | 500GB 7K500 | OS X 10.6.8 | Win7x64 Ultimate |
-Lappy: Dell Latitude D820 | C2D 2.0 | 2GB | 128GB Samsung 830 SSD | 15.4" WXGA | Win7 x86 Ultimate |
-Server: G2020 | 8GB | 500GB WD Black (OS)| 2x Seagate 4TB | 2x Segate 2TB |
Compman55 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2012, 03:30 PM   #7
JackMDS
Super Moderator
Elite Member
 
JackMDS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 1999
Posts: 26,560
Default

I have few Laptops at home with far east batteries. Surprisingly the the large big fires in my neighborhood (as well as a major flood damage to my own property) were a result of last week Hurricane Sandy, and not from Far East inexpensive Batteries.

Thinking about it the Hurricanes come here from the West.

- - - - - .


__________________
Jack
Microsoft, MVP - Networking.
JackMDS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2012, 03:57 PM   #8
mfenn
Elite Member
Super Moderator
General Hardware
 
mfenn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 21,315
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Compman55 View Post
I know they may not last as long, could have a shorter duration charge, or have a poor cosmetic appearance but can these cause damage or burn your house down?
Can they? Absolutely.
Are they more likely to have issues than a "genuine" battery? Probably.
Does that increase in probability matter? Who knows.
mfenn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-11-2012, 07:18 PM   #9
Compman55
Golden Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,001
Default

So far so good. It has a charge of 3hrs 5 min total runtime. I think that is good for the price. Hardly gets warm when charging, and the think the roginal battery only lasted from 2009, im sure this will be about the same.
__________________
-Main: Fractal Arc Midi R2 | Z87-Pro | E3-1245V3 | 32GB | M500 240GB | Antec HCG-620m PSU | Win7x64 Pro | Dual Dell U2414H Borderless IPS Panels w/ MDS14 stand |
-HTPC: Mac mini | P7550 2.26 | 8GB | 500GB 7K500 | OS X 10.6.8 | Win7x64 Ultimate |
-Lappy: Dell Latitude D820 | C2D 2.0 | 2GB | 128GB Samsung 830 SSD | 15.4" WXGA | Win7 x86 Ultimate |
-Server: G2020 | 8GB | 500GB WD Black (OS)| 2x Seagate 4TB | 2x Segate 2TB |
Compman55 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2012, 04:55 AM   #10
buggers
Member
 
buggers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 51
Default

hmm, bought a china made battey in local place, which is cheap and fast delivery, so far so good.
buggers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-14-2012, 10:11 AM   #11
pauldun170
Platinum Member
 
pauldun170's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 2,185
Default

Cheap chinese made battery in phone = no explosions. Works fine
Cheap chinese made battery in laptop = no explosions. Works fine

Keep in mind that phone is old and outdated and laptop is old and creaky so its no big loss for me if either goes kaplooey.
pauldun170 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2012, 02:59 PM   #12
dolbark
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 8
Default

Hi Compman55,

There is an increased risk of a fire or even explosion with generic cells made from China and I will explain why. The battery industry technically calls the threat "Thermal Runaway". Sounds catchy hun? What it means is that the intense temperatures that these things burn at (700-900F) results in all cells catching fire. Explosions are also a threat if heat and pressure builds up rapidly.

The most dangerous issues have occurred in the past when metal filings from the cells casing fell into the li-Ion electrolyte inside the cell. (Think of the Dell/Sony battery recall 2008 ish.. I know these are not generics... I will get to the point quickly)

So why are the cheap generics at a high risk???

After the Dell and Sony recalls the major manufactures improved their manufacturing facilities so that all batteries are manufactured in a "Clean Room" akin to what intel uses when making CPU's. It is very expensive to do this. Many generic cell makers in china have not implemented this nor do they pass UL1642 certification.

In fact, Panasonic back in 2009 and Samsung have recently added technology which significantly improves the safety profile for these two brand. Panasonic calls it HRL technology (Heat Resistant Layer) and SFL for Samsung (Safety Function Layer).

Conclusion: Even if a large number of people successfully use these generic cells, that doesn't mean they are safe given what we know now. To me safe means at a minimum
1.) UL1642 certified cells – If you can’t meet this standard then %100 no reason to buy.
2.) Manufactured in a “Clean Room” - (Samsung/ Panasonic/Sony/LG/Sanyo all do this).
3.) HRL/SFL technology – The A+ for attempting to make the safest cells and creating higher standards . Only Panasonic , and some Samsung use this technology

Here is an example of a laptop battery that I bought for my Dell a few months ago – Uses UL1642 Panasonic cells with HRL technology cost is ~$70 which is still much cheaper then OEM at $135 from Dell. Note: My original Dell battery was rated at 5200mAh and this one is rated @ 5900mAh… so I considered it an upgrade because of the increase in power capacity and 2-3 year service life.

Also, you said you were eyeing a $16 battery. I would be very weary of the sub $20 battery on Amazon and Ebay. Typically li-ion cell that are new cost between $3-$6 when bought in volume. So realistically anything below $25 is most like used, refurbished, or very old. At $16 bucks I would suspect that the cells are refurbish or very old. If they are, expect 8-12 months of service life tops.

$35-$50 seems the average price for a decent 4400mAh that use li-ion cells from a reputable manufacture. At the $50 - $60 range expect 5200mAh.

Hope this helps
Bart

Last edited by dolbark; 11-16-2012 at 03:22 PM. Reason: typo
dolbark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2012, 03:13 PM   #13
dolbark
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 8
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pauldun170 View Post
Cheap chinese made battery in phone = no explosions. Works fine
Cheap chinese made battery in laptop = no explosions. Works fine

Keep in mind that phone is old and outdated and laptop is old and creaky so its no big loss for me if either goes kaplooey.

Here is a cell phone battery fire that happened recently
dolbark is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:33 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.