Deal or No Deal - 1980 Porsche 911sc

[Fritzo]

http://www.hemmings.com/classifieds/...c/1483670.html

Description:
1980 Porsche 911SC, car has had a turbo charger added. Newer paint, new interior, high end sound system, newer tires, car is in near mint condition, you wont be disapointed. Serial# 91ao1426xx. I think '79 was the last year turbo 911s were sent here but not sure. This car looks like a turbo, also has targa top.

$15000. Nice price, and has some sharp mods, but aftermarket mods can be problematic. 125000 miles is actually not bad on these cars as the air cooled 3.0 in the 78-83 911's is known for going strong to 250K miles.

So, deal or no deal?

[Zenmervolt]

Aftermarket turbo? They'd need to pay me to take the car away. Just not worth the hassle.

Yes, it's possible to do an aftermarket turbo right, but it comes out very expensive and you've got a one-off engine management system that never works quite as well as stock and you're adding boost to a block and reciprocating assembly that were never designed for that. Too many people just slap on a turbo without doing any upgrades to the crank, rods, pistons, etc. Not to mention that the transaxles for the turbo models were substantially strengthened (that's why the turbos had a 4-speed gearbox instead of the 5-speed box in normal 911s) so they would need to have swapped that too unless you want to worry about grenading the stock transaxle.

I wouldn't touch it with a 10-foot pole. If you want a vintage turbo, buy one that came that way from the factory. Otherwise, find a nice, near stock 3.0 SC without some hack-job turbo setup.

ZV

[halik]

No way. Aftermarket widebody (probably fiberglass, bleh) and targas aren't exactly desirable.

[Zargon]

why is fiberglass a bad thing?

Ive been in many 'aftermarket' turbo systems that worked great

[Fritzo]

Originally Posted by Zargon

why is fiberglass a bad thing?

Ive been in many 'aftermarket' turbo systems that worked great

To get a turbo kit to fit on that motor, you had to upgrade a lot of things, so it's not like they just bolted one on. When dealing with classic cars however, keeping as stock as possible is the safest way to go because you can use off the shelf parts instead of having to find special components.

[Arkaign]

Could be amazing, could be terrible. Really impossible to know unless you had a Porsche expert on hand to check it all out.

eg; I'd trust RUF/RAC to do an absolutely superb job of adding a turbo to that car, I really wouldn't trust most with a job like that though.

[drnickriviera]

That year still have the cable operated clutch? My brothers 78' nearly killed my knee in stop and go traffic.

[Fritzo]

Originally Posted by drnickriviera

That year still have the cable operated clutch? My brothers 78' nearly killed my knee in stop and go traffic.

Yeah, they used cable clutches until 89 I believe.

[Drako]

Looks weird jacked up so high.

[Sluggo]

Buying a 911 isn't something I would do on a whim, they are finicky beasts, and there are tons of crappy hack jobs out there just waiting to bleed you dry.

I would start here:
http://www.pelicanparts.com/911/tech...uthrie_faq.htm

Then do a lot of reading here:
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/

[Fritzo]

Originally Posted by Sluggo

Buying a 911 isn't something I would do on a whim, they are finicky beasts, and there are tons of crappy hack jobs out there just waiting to bleed you dry.

I would start here:
http://www.pelicanparts.com/911/tech...uthrie_faq.htm

Then do a lot of reading here:
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/

I'm a bit of a Porsche enthusiast The 78-84 911SC is probably the best choice for a classic Porsche because they are VERY reliable. That 3.0L air-cooled engine will run forever, and you can get a great example for well under $20000 (not to mention the iconic Porsche looks). I usually recommend them next to a 2005 Boxster if someone wants to get into P-cars.

[Sluggo]

Originally Posted by Fritzo

I'm a bit of a Porsche enthusiast The 78-84 911SC is probably the best choice for a classic Porsche because they are VERY reliable. That 3.0L air-cooled engine will run forever, and you can get a great example for well under $20000 (not to mention the iconic Porsche looks). I usually recommend them next to a 2005 Boxster if someone wants to get into P-cars.

I agree with all of that, and an SC may well be the next fun car I buy, I read the Pelican ads everyday. We've only had the Boxster (a 99) since February, but its almost gotten to the point my wife drives it more than me, so she may just take it over.

There is a 1980 911 on Rennlist that I have been lusting over, if we had any extra money I would be calling about it.

[halik]

Why not consider a 996? The silver one is puuurty.

[NutBucket]

Why are targas not as desireable?

[Fritzo]

Originally Posted by NutBucket

Why are targas not as desirable?

It depends on who you talk to. Some people don't like the possible leakage issues, some don't like the way the roof looks, some claim the air resistance and less rigidity hurts the performance. All of those are things that people that track their cars worry about.

Personally I like the Targa because it gives you a roadster and sportscar combined into one.

Now the Cabriolet with the full drop-top is not a good buy. The tops on those cars are expensive and difficult to live with.

As for the 996 question, you're looking at $30000+ for a decent example...not quite starter money.

[Zargon]

Originally Posted by Fritzo

To get a turbo kit to fit on that motor, you had to upgrade a lot of things, so it's not like they just bolted one on. When dealing with classic cars however, keeping as stock as possible is the safest way to go because you can use off the shelf parts instead of having to find special components.

sounds boring


obv if it screams hackjob run away

[NutBucket]

Originally Posted by Fritzo

It depends on who you talk to. Some people don't like the possible leakage issues, some don't like the way the roof looks, some claim the air resistance and less rigidity hurts the performance. All of those are things that people that track their cars worry about.

Personally I like the Targa because it gives you a roadster and sportscar combined into one.

That's more or less my opinion on the topic.

[Zenmervolt]

Originally Posted by Zargon

I've been in many 'aftermarket' turbo systems that worked great

A lot of them do "work great." For a year or two. And then you blow the head gasket coming out of a 2nd gear corner because the kit didn't do any upgrades to the head studs/bolts and are trying to run 10 PSI of positive manifold pressure with the standard compression ratio. Or something in the completely custom ECU that you've had to implement goes wonky and your local mechanic won't touch the thing because it's too damn much work to figure out a completely unique system and they can make money much more efficiently working on stock engines, which leaves you having to take the car to a custom shop that charges $100+/hour in labor because they're specialty. Or until you blow out the ring and pinion on the transaxle because it's not strong enough to take the extra power.

There are just way too many crappy modification jobs out there for me to be willing to gamble on one unless I have a really damn good reason for it. In this case, there are more than enough 911 Turbos around and these factory cars have a reputation for being solid. There's no need to muck around with someone else's project here.

It's one thing to be Jay Leno and create a one-off jet powered car, or to be a hot rod guy who wants to build a Deuce Coupe with a custom supercharged flathead and a custom MegaSquirt EFI setup because you like to tinker with it and you're OK with having to spend a lot of time and money to make it right. It's something else to buy a car from a random guy you've never met and trust that he did things correctly when what you really want is a car that you can just drive.

ZV

[Insomniator]

God damnit i want a Porsche

[nerp]

ANother chop job. Risky. Too many miles for the price. Car isn't worth half the asking price. And that's assuming the underside/frame is spotless.

[power_hour]

Used Porsche with a Turbo? No thanks. Age is never kind to Turbos. Rebuilds are a tempest in a teapot.

If I was buying a used Porsche, I would look for the (84-89) 911 3.2 (Flat 6 - under 6secs). Less to worry about.

[Fritzo]

Originally Posted by power_hour

Used Porsche with a Turbo? No thanks. Age is never kind to Turbos. Rebuilds are a tempest in a teapot.

If I was buying a used Porsche, I would look for the (84-89) 911 3.2 (Flat 6 - under 6secs). Less to worry about.

I agree about the turbo- older turbo designs didn't get any oil for the first several seconds of the engine running, giving them a lower life span. However, a modern turbo design would normally compensate for that.

As for an 84-89 911, the price for these really jumps up. Expect a good model to be in the $25000-$30000 range.

[A5]

Originally Posted by Fritzo

I'm a bit of a Porsche enthusiast The 78-84 911SC is probably the best choice for a classic Porsche because they are VERY reliable. That 3.0L air-cooled engine will run forever, and you can get a great example for well under $20000 (not to mention the iconic Porsche looks). I usually recommend them next to a 2005 Boxster if someone wants to get into P-cars.

Any particular reason you recommend the 2005 Boxster specifically?

[Fritzo]

Originally Posted by A5

Any particular reason you recommend the 2005 Boxster specifically?

It was the first year of the design switch from the 986 to the 987. It has more room inside, more HP, improved looks, and is better in every way. It's also usually cheap, with non-S versions available under $20000 depending on the time of year, and S versions for under $25000.

[Howard]

Originally Posted by Fritzo

It was the first year of the design switch from the 986 to the 987. It has more room inside, more HP, improved looks, and is better in every way. It's also usually cheap, with non-S versions available under $20000 depending on the time of year, and S versions for under $25000.

Less cheap when you factor in the IMS bearing replacement.